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92 5-Speed Tracker hard shifting while stopped.

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92 5-Speed Tracker hard shifting while stopped.
« on: August 03, 2012, 07:41:18 PM »
I've been fixing things little by little on the Tracker just getting it ready for winter duty. I still have one nagging problem that I wanted help diagnosing before I buy unnecessary parts or break something.
When I start the truck in the morning and keep the clutch pressed I can shift into all gears smooth as butter. Same goes for when the truck is off. If I'm sitting there letting the old girl warm up and I let off the clutch, depress it again and try to shift it'll be more difficult to get into gear. No grinds, it just has to be wiggled, bumped or forced into gear. When I'm driving shifting is fine and it will continue to shift into all forward gears well as long as I'm rolling. The only time the trans complains while on the move is if I try to shift too fast from 1-2. Otherwise no problems. Only when sitting still with the engine running will it give me any issues.
I tried adjusting the clutch cable as it was definitely loose on the clutch arm and that seems to have made the clutch feel better and possibly help with the 1-2 shift but it's still a pain in the arse to shift while standing. I'm thinking the clutch cable may be the problem but I'm more used to dealing with hydraulic clutch systems. I changed the trans oil last fall with 75w90 valvoline as suggested by other forum members and it doesn't leak so it's probably not a fluid problem.
Anybody got any ideas? It drives me nuts to fight with the shifter when I should be going on a green light and I don't want to damage the transmission or clutch by over tightening the cable or driving it the way it is.
Thanks in advance for any advice or suggestions you may have.
Proud owner of a low mile 1992 Tracker 4x4 rust bucket.

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Offline fordem

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Re: 92 5-Speed Tracker hard shifting while stopped.
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2012, 04:11:21 AM »
What about reverse?  Does it grind going into reverse?

It sounds a lot like what is known as clutch drag - when the clutch pedal is depressed, the clutch doesn't disengage completely and the transmission input shaft continues to rotate - the reasons range from incorrect adjustment, to contaminated linings and also a possible defective pilot shaft bearing.
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Offline talonxracer

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Re: 92 5-Speed Tracker hard shifting while stopped.
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2012, 06:20:40 AM »
I had a very similar issue on my 98' Kick. I went thru two clutch pedals(welds between cross shaft and pedal sheared) and three cables. I put in a new pedal, still very stiff pedal feel and as everything warms up shifting gets very notchy. Installed a new clutch cable from NAPA, the Altrom Ultra8(33$) and DID NOT use the stock cable retension wire that holds it up and away from the header and the clutch is now silky smooth and the required pressure is very easy.

Here is a pic showing my cable with additional rubber tube and thermal tape.


Notice the wire cable retainer that is several inches away from the cable, it pulls the cable up and out, this applies alot of pressure to the cable, the cable housing and the firewall fitting, leading to failure.
here is where all of the cables I have seen have failed(including several in junkyards and other wheelers I have checked)
Tim "the toolman" Taylor is my HERO !!!

The only GOOD Commie is the commie taking a dirt nap....

Re: 92 5-Speed Tracker hard shifting while stopped.
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2012, 06:43:33 PM »
It grinds going into reverse once in awhile but usually only when I try to shift too fast. My Fiero and other manuals I've driven have all had a grind into reverse when switching between forward and reverse too quickly. I'm going to go ahead and order a new cable and adjust it per my FSM to see if that clears the issue up. According to the previous owner the truck had the clutch changed at around 100k miles. It now has just over 120k so I hope whatever mechanic replaced the clutch checked everything out before slapping it back together.
Thanks for the advice guys. I'll try your trick talonx, I still have some reflective wrap left over from my other cars shift cable refresh so i can keep from kinking the cable with that hook.
I'll update later if the issue is resolved or not. If not hopefully suzuki made these things easy to clutch work on.
Proud owner of a low mile 1992 Tracker 4x4 rust bucket.

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Offline Skyhiranger

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Re: 92 5-Speed Tracker hard shifting while stopped.
« Reply #4 on: August 06, 2012, 07:03:46 AM »
.......I tried adjusting the clutch cable as it was definitely loose on the clutch arm...... 

There is supposed to be a little cable play at the clutch arm (the clutch arm should "wiggle" back and forth just a little bit (1/4" or so), when you move it back and forth with your hand).  Otherwise, the clutch fork is pushing the throwout bearing against the pressure plate fingers and the TO bearing is spinning all the time (which will wear out the TO bearing prematurely).
For the shifting issue....
It could be the clutch cable is stretched and no adjustment will allow it to disengage the clutch properly. 
It could a dragging/stuck pilot bearing, as suggested. When the clutch was replaced, it should have had a new pilot bearing put in too, so it shouldn't be a pilot bearing issue.
It could be something inside the tranny (probably not, though). 
It could be the clutch (not likely, since the clutch had been replaced fairly recently). 
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Re: 92 5-Speed Tracker hard shifting while stopped.
« Reply #5 on: August 06, 2012, 10:34:12 AM »
Good stuff to know sky. I'm ordering the cable soon. When I swap it out I'm going to check out the clutch pedal to make sure it's also giving the maximum amount of travel possible. Judging by the original cable end near the clutch arm it's pretty old. The threads required a lot of penetrating oil, some heat and vice grips to even get the adjustment nut to move. I didn't tighten it enough to load the arm I just took up most of the slack.
Proud owner of a low mile 1992 Tracker 4x4 rust bucket.

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Offline FireCkrEd

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Re: 92 5-Speed Tracker hard shifting while stopped.
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2012, 05:56:01 AM »
I had a heck of a time with my clutch adjustment too. My outer cable sheath was shot and I couldn't see it, so when adjusted in the driveway it felt fine but a short drive later I would loose the adjustment and I couldn't shift. A new cable took care of it and no problems since.


              Ed
93 4dr Kick, stock, + 95 4dr W/TTough kit, Toy axles, 4.24 xfercase gears, 5.71 gears, Ramsey 9500 winch, twin stick xfercase, 33" BFG's
97, 4dr with a 2" lift (needs an engine re-build)
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Re: 92 5-Speed Tracker hard shifting while stopped.
« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2012, 05:38:37 PM »
Hey all I just wanted to post an update on this issue so it can help others out in the future.

I've done a lot of reading in my '92 FSM and textbooks regarding clutch and manual trans issues. I'd been losing engine oil and had some clutch chatter when first starting out including the above issue so I started checking all over the engine to find a leak. Turns out I had the classic leaking distributor housing. It was leaking oil all over the bell housing and oil was dripping all the way down to the middle of the trans. When I pulled it the o ring was completely flat and hard as a rock. I couldn't source one locally so I cleaned the crap out of the area and RTV'd the flange, reinstalled then let it sit overnight. The next day I degreased everything and bombed everything inside of the bell housing with brake cleaner as best I could. Now I can come to a stop, release the clutch and wait for a light then press the clutch pedal and wait a second and the trans will slip into first as it should without any resistance. The few times the clutch did stick in the days after I stopped the leak I was able to hit the clutch and jab the gas to unstick it. I'm hoping any remaining contamination won't fry the clutch early but it seems to be functioning as designed and there's no more chatter in the morning after it's sat overnight.
Thanks for everybody's help on this issue and for F--- sake check your dist housing and fix any leaks quick before it causes you more grief than just topping up the oil every now and then. If I'd let this go on too long it surely would have fried my clutch and annihilated my synchros. Not to mention it was extremely annoying to say the least.

Later!
Proud owner of a low mile 1992 Tracker 4x4 rust bucket.