A friend of mine has a '99 GV with what we suspect is a bent housing or something screwy.  He's had three r&p failures in three seperate thirds in less than 120k on the thing.  The housing has always been the same, factory original one so I'm theorizing that something is out of kilter and is causing the troubles.

Meanwhile he has Sidekick 5.12's in it and needs 5.12 rear gears.  I was wondering if instead of getting another GV axle and then a Sidekick/Tracker 5.12 third for said axle (and ending up with a left over GV third) he could just get a XL7 rear axle from an auto which would have matching 5.12 gears?  The sticking point now is figuring out if a XL7 axle would swap in.
Has anyone done this?
Anyone have measurements to compare them with?

I know some of you guys on here have 99+ Vitaras/GV's/Trackers AND XL7's?

Nope, I don't have both cars hehe
Couldn't the problem be from using Sidekick r&p? I think they are a bit weaker than the GV ones, and if you have a 160+hp engine, that might be the problem. Besides, I would have thought a bent axle might give you problems with the sidegears, no the r&p.
What I would do is get a 4 cyl GV third, at least here they come with the 5.125 ratio if they have a manual gearbox. But maybe you don't have many over there...
Just a thought...

If I recall correctly the 4-cyl Vitara diffs here are the same as the later Sidekick diffs.  The V6 trucks got bigger rear diffs...I think...

Gear in Australia is running a '03 GV with the Calmini lift system, 31" tires, ARB's front and rear, and wheeling the piss out of the thing and all he breaks are axleshafts.  I've heard of other people doing the same thing without troubles either.


I should clarify that the latest third is a Sidekick third, the first two were GV thirds.  The thing is also his dinghy that he tows behind his motorhome.  At least half of it's mileage WASN'T under power.

Well....

The XL-7 axle itself will just bolt right in.  And it is a ton beefier.  The biggest issue is the driveshaft.  The flange is totally different (I think it's a 3-bolt triangular flange on the XL versus a round 4-bolt flange on the Tracker...so I imagine a GV, too).  It's also an inch or so longer, projecting forward.  I ended up having a driveshaft shop hack off the ends of both and welding the end (with the 3-bolt cv joint) from the XL onto the Tracker driveshaft, appropriately shortened.

Another issue is that the mounting points for the panhard bar are slightly off so, unless you shorten it or get an adjustable/custom bar or get creative with the mounting points, the axle will be offset about 3/4" toward the left side.  Still haven't remedied that on mine..

The only other thing I can think of is the parking brake cable ends are totally different where they attach behind the drums.  I finally just ordered new XL cables and will just coil the excess length somewhere if I can't find somewhere that can shorten them properly.   You could probably fab up a better solution.

Hey man, thanks for the experiences, I've passed them on.

What's the situation on the panhard bar?  Any solutions you've run across and decided not to use, searching for the correct one, or (as I usually am) "eh, it starts up and goes so it's not terribly important."

Hey, man, thanks a bunch!!!!!!!!!

I'm said friend who is having a time with pinion breakage.  FWIW, I've broken three, the OEM, a second GV V6 pumpkin, and a 5.12 'Kick diff.  The OEM lasted longest, the second GV one lasted all of about 5K miles, and the 'Kick diff lasted about 15K.

I thought about having a fourth one cryogenically treated, but after seeing the difference between the 'Kick diff, the GV's, and the XL-7's, I'm an idiot to not slap an XL rear axle in there, if it's not too much of a problem.  I'm semi-crippled, but it's fairly recent, so I still do the same stupid things I used to, like dive into a project, not knowing what's waiting for me.

I'll have to call around and see if there is a driveshaft shop here in Lost Wages which has been in business for more than 8 months, and see what the cost is gonna be.  It really doesn't matter much, as in 50 more miles, the GV is going to be a planter at the rate the diff is getting louder.  Can't feel it, yet, but I've been there in the past.

I'll see what I can find out about the Panhard rod.  I figure it has to be shorter on the XL, um, wait, longer.  Nevermind, it's dark out, I don't remember which way it goes.  With the rest of it bolting up, the rod should be an easy swap.

"Easy".  I'll have to remember that.

I'm thinking with a complete, but obviously defective, in some way, GV rear axle, I can cannibalize the parts needed to make the XL's e-brake hardware work with the GV's cables.  If not, time to get creative.

Again, thanks a bunch.  I didn't want to drive 300 miles only to find out something essentially unchangable kept this from working.

Kelly

Good to see you here man.

Never got the old password to work?

Did what's his face ever get back about the European diesel GV panhard rods?

I think my old login expired, or something.  Strangely enough, my login still seemed valid, but my password seemed to be lost forever.  I start off as newbie.  Fine by me.

No word yet on the Panhard rod.  I'm going to take a good look at mine and see if I can figure out the different in mine and the XL's.

I'll see what I can find out about the Panhard rod.  I figure it has to be shorter on the XL, um, wait, longer.

Nope...  The panhard rods themselves are 100% identical --(edit - the ends are wider on the XL-7 panhard, I just used washers to fill the gap at the x-7 axle mount end to fill in the gap, since re-using the Tracker's bar made more sense as it actually fit into the frame-end mount)--.  The frames at the rear of the trucks are different, though, so the mount location on the frame end is in a different location, left to right.  To compensate, the other mount is located at a slightly different position on the axle. 

Basically, the frame-end mount on the XL-7 is a little farther to the right, so when you put the axle in the narrower Vitara rear, it's pushed slightly to the left (about 3/4"-ish, total, so I guess the bar should be about half that shorter?  I haven't totally worked that out yet myself..).

Actually, if you lift your truck enough, all will work out perfectly!

Another thing to consider.... By using the XL rear, you're wiping out any real opportunity to put a locker or anything back there.  There aren't any.  To make up for that, however, I'm going rig cutting brakes back there, using separate parking brake levers for the left and right.  Don't know how responsive they'll be, being cable actuated and all, but I'll start work on it in the next week or so and let you know how it goes.

Thanks, beercheck.  I'm thinking, while I have the 'new' XL axle out, I'll have the panhard rod mount cut and rewelded 3/4 of an inch.

Though I do like the idea of lifting it far enough to eliminate the problem.  AJMBLAZER lifted his old one enough to get there, probably, and his write-up of it couldn't be more comprehensive.

Sorry, I know this is the XL-7 forum, but if you're gonna make a mutant, you've gotta ask around pretty much everywhere.

Right now, my only concern is will the 3/4 of an inch make the 225/75/16's rub on the LR fender if I hit more than a pebble...  With the OEM "shocks" and 245/70's, it rubbed pretty often.

Thanks, beercheck.  I'm thinking, while I have the 'new' XL axle out, I'll have the panhard rod mount cut and rewelded 3/4 of an inch.

For goodness' sake, double check my measurements!  I'm pretty sure you only need to shorten it by that much at MOST.  My "measurement" is just eyeballing how far in the right side is to how far out the left side is, with reference to the surrounding body molding.  It seems to be somewhere between 1 and 1-1/2" difference, but I haven't been scientific about it yet.  1-1/4" difference would mean 5/8" worth of shortening (or moving).  Just find how far from the axle's center point the mount is on the outgoing axle and reproduce it on the new one.  I never did that when I had the chance.

Right now, my only concern is will the 3/4 of an inch make the 225/75/16's rub on the LR fender if I hit more than a pebble...  With the OEM "shocks" and 245/70's, it rubbed pretty often.

I doubt it'll make any difference at all, since you really aren't narrowing anything, just re-centering.  But I've never run anything bigger than 235/75/15s, so I can't be totally convincing.  235/70/16s go on sometime in the next two weeks.

For goodness' sake, double check my measurements!  I'm pretty sure you only need to shorten it by that much at MOST.  My "measurement" is just eyeballing how far in the right side is to how far out the left side is, with reference to the surrounding body molding.  It seems to be somewhere between 1 and 1-1/2" difference, but I haven't been scientific about it yet.  1-1/4" difference would mean 5/8" worth of shortening (or moving).  Just find how far from the axle's center point the mount is on the outgoing axle and reproduce it on the new one.  I never did that when I had the chance.

Oh, I figured me and the tape measure would become close buds when I take this on.  I want it to be correct the first time.

I got what you mean about recentering.  After thinking about it, you're right, I'd have to lift it like 4" to get it centered, which ain't happenin'.  I'm not likely to go any higher than the rear spacers got me, about 1/2 - 3/4 of an inch, as that's all I wanted...to even out the stance.  It always looked a little 'nose up' to me.

The parking brake cable difference.

The XL-7's has an angled fitting that is attached by bolt over a slot (you can see it in the background) which the cable then goes through, at an angle.



The Tracker's has a straight spring-loaded end that pushes through a round hole in a surface that has been pushed out to create the angle.



The Tracker's raised mounting surface:




You could re-create the protuberance (how's that for fancypants..) by cutting a small piece of pipe at an angle, closing the round end to a hole of the right diameter for the cable's spring end to fit through, and welding the angled edges over the slot on the flange.  Or something like that.

Thanks for the pictures.  Now I know what I'm getting into.  Interesting.  Looks like there is room for creativity...

A thought...couldn't a person keep the entire GV brake backing plate, assembly, e-brake stuff, and just bolt it onto the XL's housing?

I know there's something which prevents this, I am unsure as to what, but I figure it's a problem.

One other thought about the mutant driveshaft.  Does anyone know if the yokes of the GV and XL-7 have the same splines?  If so, then it's a simple swap of diff yokes, and you're done.  I've learned a mutant driveshaft is gonna run me a good $500 for parts and to have it made.  $400 just to make it, but I need the $100 XL shaft to boot.  Plus, having stuff in Vegas made, and having it turn out correct, is a roll of the dice, no pun intended.

A thought...couldn't a person keep the entire GV brake backing plate, assembly, e-brake stuff, and just bolt it onto the XL's housing?

I know there's something which prevents this, I am unsure as to what, but I figure it's a problem.

There's a significant drum-size difference, but I never really looked at it like that.

One other thought about the mutant driveshaft.  Does anyone know if the yokes of the GV and XL-7 have the same splines?  If so, then it's a simple swap of diff yokes, and you're done. 

I'm 99.9% certain the splines were the same, but you're still going to have to deal with the shortened distance between the tranny output and the flange on the larger rear diff.

I've learned a mutant driveshaft is gonna run me a good $500 for parts and to have it made.  $400 just to make it, but I need the $100 XL shaft to boot.  Plus, having stuff in Vegas made, and having it turn out correct, is a roll of the dice, no pun intended.

Labor only cost me $100, and I didn't get any sort of a sweetheart deal as far as I know.

I used these  guys.  Did great work as far as I was concerned:

Driveshafts Unlimited
636-296-2841
3608 Market Pl
Arnold MO 63010