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Body Lift Concerns

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Offline z28jeff

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Body Lift Concerns
« on: June 18, 2019, 05:30:41 AM »
A little over a week ago, I installed Jeff's 2" spacer lift to my Tracker, added Air Lift airbags to the rear, and put on new 15x8 wheels with 30x9.50 Achilles DesertHawk M/T's. I love the new look. It's exactly what I was going for. However, I now have some tire rub on the bottom of the fender liners on the rear of the front wheels when turning near full lock. It's not major, and really only does it when pulling into/backing out of a parking spot, but I figure it will be much worse in offroad situations, so I do want to correct this issue. As you can see, the Tracker is in very good condition, so I don't want to start hacking things to make clearance. The only real option is a body lift. I'm not a big fan of body lifts, so I've never looked that hard into the details of installing one until now. It seems there are some serious areas of concern when lifting a 99-05 Tracker/GV that aren't well documented on the forums. The biggest problem that I can't seem to get my head around is relocating the front bumper cover. The attached photo shows my Tracker with no bumper cover attached. Here it shows the steel bumper that lives behind the plastic bumper cover. This bumper is attached to the frame rails and does not raise with a body lift. In fact, I don't see how it could be raised at all since it attaches into the the front frame rails. Of course you could just remove it and that would make it much easier to relocate the bumper cover, but is that what people are doing? I don't feel comfortabe doing that at all.
Also, I was hoping to just do a 1" body lift. (I don't need much). Would I still have interference issues with the strut tower brace? Would I still need to extend the steering shaft? I have searched this forum and several others for the past week for my answers, but all I can find are 10-15 year old threads with dead links and pictures that won't load. Mostly looking for some tips/tricks from folks who have done this already.
2003 Tracker 4 door 2.0 auto
2013 Suzuki Kizashi SLS AWD
2002 Corvette Z06

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Online fordem

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Re: Body Lift Concerns
« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2019, 12:05:20 PM »
I think the solution to your dilemma is to go to a smaller tire - 235/75R15 should do it - and maybe on a narrower rim - something like a 15 x 7.

I recognize this is not what you want to hear, but I do think it's a better approach than a body lift - not only does it eliminate the need for the questions you're asking now, it addresses a few other issues that you have not yet mentioned, for example the impact that larger tires have on general performance.

First, a bit of background, I'm running a 98 African market Grand Vitara with the 2.0 liter J20a engine, so very similar to what you have - the vehicle is equipped with OME springs, struts & shocks, which give it a little less lift than you have, and I'm running 236/70R16 tires (which work out to a hair under 29 inches) on OEM GV 16x7 alloys.  I get frame rub at the back of the front arches on full lock, and had to cut back the lower edge of the front bumper by about an inch just to be able to steer without the tire making contact.

Your 30x9.5 DesertHawks are a 29.5 inch tire, so a little bit taller than I'm running, and you don't mention any frame rubbing, so your wheels probably have a little less backspacing than mine do, but at 15 x 8, that's going to put the outer edge of the rim quite a bit closer to both the front and back of the arch when at full lock - a narrower rim with the 30x9.5 tires might also solve the problem (anything from 6.0~8.5 is acceptable).

Let's go back to the performance issues - switching from a 27 inch tire to a 29.5 represents a change in gearing of about 9%, which is going to have a significant impact on general "driveability" - on road acceleration is going to be affected, fuel consumption is going to be affected, and also off road performance, especially if you have to use low range.  The larger tire is also going to be heavier, which is going to negatively impact your brake performance.  The reason I mentioned that my car was African market is because the African market vehicles get different axle gears to the US market, better suited to off road use, and if I'm feeling the impact of a 29 inch tire with those gears, you have got to be feeling a 29.5 with your gears.  GVs also have bigger disks in front than the Trackers.

Think about it ...
'98 SQ420 Grand Vitara
'05 JB420 Grand Vitara
'16 APK416 Vitara
'21 A6G415 Jimny

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Re: Body Lift Concerns
« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2019, 05:49:21 PM »
One more thing - if you're going to take that car off pavement, get rid of that cone filter and put back the original air box and use an OEM style paper filter
'98 SQ420 Grand Vitara
'05 JB420 Grand Vitara
'16 APK416 Vitara
'21 A6G415 Jimny

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Offline z28jeff

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Re: Body Lift Concerns
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2019, 05:21:33 AM »
I think the solution to your dilemma is to go to a smaller tire - 235/75R15 should do it - and maybe on a narrower rim - something like a 15 x 7.

I recognize this is not what you want to hear, but I do think it's a better approach than a body lift - not only does it eliminate the need for the questions you're asking now, it addresses a few other issues that you have not yet mentioned, for example the impact that larger tires have on general performance.

First, a bit of background, I'm running a 98 African market Grand Vitara with the 2.0 liter J20a engine, so very similar to what you have - the vehicle is equipped with OME springs, struts & shocks, which give it a little less lift than you have, and I'm running 236/70R16 tires (which work out to a hair under 29 inches) on OEM GV 16x7 alloys.  I get frame rub at the back of the front arches on full lock, and had to cut back the lower edge of the front bumper by about an inch just to be able to steer without the tire making contact.

Your 30x9.5 DesertHawks are a 29.5 inch tire, so a little bit taller than I'm running, and you don't mention any frame rubbing, so your wheels probably have a little less backspacing than mine do, but at 15 x 8, that's going to put the outer edge of the rim quite a bit closer to both the front and back of the arch when at full lock - a narrower rim with the 30x9.5 tires might also solve the problem (anything from 6.0~8.5 is acceptable).

Let's go back to the performance issues - switching from a 27 inch tire to a 29.5 represents a change in gearing of about 9%, which is going to have a significant impact on general "driveability" - on road acceleration is going to be affected, fuel consumption is going to be affected, and also off road performance, especially if you have to use low range.  The larger tire is also going to be heavier, which is going to negatively impact your brake performance.  The reason I mentioned that my car was African market is because the African market vehicles get different axle gears to the US market, better suited to off road use, and if I'm feeling the impact of a 29 inch tire with those gears, you have got to be feeling a 29.5 with your gears.  GVs also have bigger disks in front than the Trackers.

Think about it ...
Everything you said is correct, and I've given all those solutions some thought, but I am stubborn, and determined to fix this in a way that satisfies my OCD. :)
As far as the power loss issue, I've anticipated that and bought 5.13 3rd members for the front/rear axles. I just haven't had a chance to install them yet. I also wanted to drive around with this setup on the stock gearing for a few weeks so that I can really appreciate the 5.13's when they go in. Much to my surprise, the 4.88's are handling the new wheel/tire combo better then I thought they would. I've put about 400 miles on it since the lift, and have lost about 3-4 mpg. I also weighed each new wheel/tire against the old stock wheel with 225/75 setup, and the delta was 17 lbs. That's a lot of extra unsprung weight, especially for the torqueless 2.0. So all things considered, I'm satisfied with the performance. On 2 lane hilly roads with speeds under 60 mph, (which is 90% of my driving) it's fine. It does drop into 3rd sooner, and has to hold it longer, but that's to be expected. It likes the interstate a whole lot less. Maintaining 70-75mph is more of a struggle for it. It's fine on level, but every hill it comes to it unlocks the torque converter, and often kicks down to 3rd (which is over 4k rpm at that speed). The 5.13's will surely make it better. How much better remains to be seen. I don't expect it to be back to stock power levels, but anywhere between stock and where it's at now will be a welcome improvement.
You're right about the wheel size too. I originally started looking for a 15x7, but my choices were so limited I had to consider a 15x8 to find something I liked. And I do like the ones I chose. Aesthetics are important to me. I know that's unusual in the offroad community, but I can't help it. It's just who I am. Modifications are always full of compromises. I'm just trying to get as close to having my cake and eating it too as possible.
You don't like my $35 Ebay intake? :)   
2003 Tracker 4 door 2.0 auto
2013 Suzuki Kizashi SLS AWD
2002 Corvette Z06

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Re: Body Lift Concerns
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2019, 11:50:34 AM »
I've no problem with your intake, I just don't think your engine will like the dirt that passes through it - I've run K&N filters on street cars, but, having done that, I know better than to use them off pavement.

I've no personal experience with body lifts - you may be able to get away with leaving the bumper reinforcement exactly where it is if you cut the two "braces" on the top off - they are there to support the outer ends of a polyurethane "grille guard" that Suzuki offered as an option.  You might need to do some trimming underneath where it would be out of sight.  I would expect the strut tower brace to be affected, you might be able to deal with that by trimming the sheet metal, you may be able to get away without having to modify the steering column and the transfer case shifter.

Good luck.
'98 SQ420 Grand Vitara
'05 JB420 Grand Vitara
'16 APK416 Vitara
'21 A6G415 Jimny