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looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle

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Offline beagle..t

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looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle
« on: January 30, 2016, 03:57:44 PM »
well been looking for a x-7 with the 2.7 auto 4x4 to do a motor swap in my 02 2dr  (thx brd htr for putting it in my head). Well found a couple that are reasonable, whole vehicle one has a mid oil leak unknown chain rattle so im thinking rear main but while its out of the vehicle I might as well do the water pump and timing chain on either one before I squeeze it into my 02, the other one has a new water pump and chain rattle, both are 01 xl-7 autos and both are roughly 270 kms. My question is how much is too much chain rattle i.e rattles on start-up then quiet or rattles all the time. I don't know if im wasting my time with either one because of the chain rattle and if I can get it for the $$$ I want. Also as anyone bought a timing chain kit off flea bay? I've seen a complete set on there for cheaper than I can buy up here (Canada) and what other gaskets am I going to need other than the timing chain set
new rig aka "the mule" 2002 tracker
V6 swap auto  ,2 dr ,2" BL,2" jeffs kit 512 gears warn hubs and 30/9.5/15 BFG AT

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Online fordem

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Re: looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2016, 05:08:09 AM »
I'd say anything other than a split second of chain rattle on a cold start is cause for concern - BUT - if you're going to be replacing the chains, et al, then it's neither here nor there, is it?

Regarding ebay parts - just remember who it is you're dealing with - oh wait, you don't have a clue, who you're dealing with - ebay is a market place, the onus is on you to ensure that you get a quality part, especially for something as critical as timing components.

I don't think you need too much in the way of gaskets - the entire front end seals with RTV - maybe replace the valve cover gaskets whilst you have them off (those are reusable, but they do harden with age).

By the way - that's not an easy swap - there's going to be a lot of wiring work - ask brd hntr.
'98 SQ420 Grand Vitara
'05 JB420 Grand Vitara
'16 APK416 Vitara
'21 A6G415 Jimny

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Offline beagle..t

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Re: looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2016, 07:43:50 AM »
ya I know ebay is a market place. The motor swap? the motor should just bolt up to my calculations and ya the wiring is going to be a pain. I'm thinking that I could pull all wiring out through the front and use the dash, steering column, gauge cluster from the xl-7. The good thing also about the wiring is that BRD HTR is only about 1hr away from me so I can always ask me to come up and help with it if need be
new rig aka "the mule" 2002 tracker
V6 swap auto  ,2 dr ,2" BL,2" jeffs kit 512 gears warn hubs and 30/9.5/15 BFG AT

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Offline BRD HNTR

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Re: looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2016, 04:09:19 AM »
ya I know ebay is a market place. The motor swap? the motor should just bolt up to my calculations and ya the wiring is going to be a pain. I'm thinking that I could pull all wiring out through the front and use the dash, steering column, gauge cluster from the xl-7. The good thing also about the wiring is that BRD HTR is only about 1hr away from me so I can always ask me to come up and help with it if need be
While I can run up to give you a hand, my wiring blend is a lot different than your newer wiring.  You  should check the width of the XL7 dash, I believe that it is wider than your 01 dash.

Nothing goes as it should with an easy idea!!!
93 Tracker,XL7 springs & 1" raised spring pads in front with YJ springs in back, home built bumpers rear & front (w/winch), 2" x 4" rock tubes,  ARB front & rear, converted Sami rear to IFS, 33x12.5x15  aluminum rims, roll cage, 2.7L w/5 speed auto.

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Online fordem

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Re: looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2016, 04:37:29 AM »
I would expect an '01 XL-7 dash to be physically interchangeable with an '02 Tracker, as far as I know, the metal work differences ahead of the 'b' pillar are minor, there are sheet metal differences, little things like the holes for the plastic cladding, but structurally they should be the same.
'98 SQ420 Grand Vitara
'05 JB420 Grand Vitara
'16 APK416 Vitara
'21 A6G415 Jimny

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Offline beagle..t

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Re: looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2016, 07:20:58 PM »
well looked at the 2001 xl-7 today and fired it up it hadn't been started in 2months so I had to use my spare battery. Well it fired right up with very little rattle at start up was there for like 2 sec then quiet. the owner had owned  it for 10 yrs an never used 4x and never used AC he said he just rolled down the windows. I don't think that I would use the dash pad, I would just use the dash cluster and the heater controls so that I have AC ....lol. it has ABS and it has power windows and door locks  which mine does not so that would have to be bypassed, but would I have to use the steering column because of the neutral safety switch in the ignition? There are a couple of things  that I would use from the XL-7 like the side mirrors cause they fold in, and the seats cause they have the arm rests and the rest goes to scrap unless I can think or you guys can think of what else I could use
[/quote]
While I can run up to give you a hand, my wiring blend is a lot different than your newer wiring.  You  should check the width of the XL7 dash, I believe that it is wider than your 01 dash.

Nothing goes as it should with an easy idea!!!
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 ya I know nothing is easy but, I will have the fsm so I can get things right
new rig aka "the mule" 2002 tracker
V6 swap auto  ,2 dr ,2" BL,2" jeffs kit 512 gears warn hubs and 30/9.5/15 BFG AT

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Online fordem

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Re: looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle
« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2016, 06:08:18 AM »
Unless I'm very much mistaken - the neutral safety switch is on the side of the transmission - if your vehicle has a manual transmission, all you will need to do is bypass the switch.
'98 SQ420 Grand Vitara
'05 JB420 Grand Vitara
'16 APK416 Vitara
'21 A6G415 Jimny

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Offline BRD HNTR

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Re: looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle
« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2016, 09:18:07 AM »
Fordem is correct.  Using the XL7 wiring will already have bypassed the clutch safety for PNP (Park Nuetral Position) safety switch.
As you study the wiring diagrams for hours these items will become familar.
Sell what you don't want (Craigslist, Ebay, ZW classifieds), but keep the body and wiring as long as possible.  Smaller items that aren't needed, frequently become necessary and hard to find or get later.

I am always amazed by the range of information Fordem posses, especially as he doesn't modify his rigs.  My brain leaks a lot, and when working on projects the record function has not always been engaged.  His advice is to be considered valuable.  (As if you didn't already know that.)
93 Tracker,XL7 springs & 1" raised spring pads in front with YJ springs in back, home built bumpers rear & front (w/winch), 2" x 4" rock tubes,  ARB front & rear, converted Sami rear to IFS, 33x12.5x15  aluminum rims, roll cage, 2.7L w/5 speed auto.

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Offline beagle..t

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Re: looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle
« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2016, 04:21:05 PM »
ok cool so steering column stays with donor, and mark that off the list to do. I also went to library and found a micthell fsm that had wiring diagrams for both 02 tracker and 2001 xl-7 so hoping to get a photocopy of the 6 pages. Yes Fordm does have phenomenal knowledge and always good to hear his input   
new rig aka "the mule" 2002 tracker
V6 swap auto  ,2 dr ,2" BL,2" jeffs kit 512 gears warn hubs and 30/9.5/15 BFG AT

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Offline BRD HNTR

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Re: looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle
« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2016, 02:54:36 AM »
Just looking at my 2003 XL7 manual and wiring diagrams run from 9A-11 to 9A-101, where it starts lighting section with wiring diagrams and tests etc.  You do not need all those pages as some are dedicated 2.5L, but it gives you an idea of what you are approaching.  I do not know what differences there are between 01 & 03, but there is vast differences between 03 & 05.
Here is an 2001 FSM hard manual http://www.carmanuals.com/manuals/2001-SUZUKI-XL-7-Service-Manual-shop-repair-WORKSHOP-JA627_151500062388.html it is pricey, but by the time you are finished I think you will be glad you have it.  DO NOT GET A CD FSM, they are hard to use and missing information you will need (that is the kindest I can be about them).
Maybe you won't need it, as you have the donor car and all wiring, so most of what you need is what kind of power is coming in (always hot, accessory, on, on & start) to where, and where all the grounds are.  You will be running three computers ECM/PCM, BCM, & TCM.  You can fudge on the BCM and only run it to make the others know it is running and happy, unless you are connecting the AC & Heater to it.
Looking at my 99 Tracker manual & I don't see any similar plugs, so some things will have to be completely changed out, or spliced.
93 Tracker,XL7 springs & 1" raised spring pads in front with YJ springs in back, home built bumpers rear & front (w/winch), 2" x 4" rock tubes,  ARB front & rear, converted Sami rear to IFS, 33x12.5x15  aluminum rims, roll cage, 2.7L w/5 speed auto.

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Online fordem

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Re: looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle
« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2016, 03:40:37 AM »
The 01 & 02 years have less electronics - 03 was when the BCM was introduced...

And thanks for those kind words - it's not that I don't modify my vehicles, but I don't modify to the extent that you guys do - I don't have access to the sort of fabrication facilities that you guys seem to, and vehicles, even used ones, are expensive in this corner of the world.
'98 SQ420 Grand Vitara
'05 JB420 Grand Vitara
'16 APK416 Vitara
'21 A6G415 Jimny

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Offline BRD HNTR

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Re: looking at a 2.7 with chain rattle
« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2016, 08:27:03 AM »
ACK'S has your manual, electrical has 186 pages which are in 3-4 languages, so you will have to go through them and print the relevant ones.
ACK'S XL7 PAGE http://www.acksfaq.com/gvxl7fsm.htm to get to this page using search page I used the "ALL" and Searched for "H27"
GV XL7 Wiring page http://www.acksfaq.com/pdfs/FSMWiringManualGV-XL-7.pdf

This is hard to find what you will need, but it appears to be 2001, and why I prefer my own Hard Copy of the FSM.
93 Tracker,XL7 springs & 1" raised spring pads in front with YJ springs in back, home built bumpers rear & front (w/winch), 2" x 4" rock tubes,  ARB front & rear, converted Sami rear to IFS, 33x12.5x15  aluminum rims, roll cage, 2.7L w/5 speed auto.