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2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares

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Offline narnwv

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2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« on: September 16, 2012, 08:36:05 AM »
So in 2010, I bought a 2000 Chevy Tracker, with a 2.0 DOHC 4 cylinder. (some of you may remember it, I posted some pics).

I drove it about 5000 miles, and it died on the wife one day in traffic mid-October. She thought it ran out of fuel. No noises or anything when it quit. I put fuel in it, went to crank it, and noticed it sounded "hollow". Tore the valve cover off to discover a broken upper timing chain, and a chewed up sprocket on one of the cams. Knowing that it's an interference engine, I let it set while I worked on funds to replace the engine.

March of 2011, I read somewhere on this forum where something similar happened to a guy, and he was able to replace the upper timing chain, and everything was good. It seemed plausable, since when the upper chain lets go, all the valves close at once--lowering the possibility of valves kissing the pistons. I bought a complete timing set off of ebay for $90 (both chains, all 4 sprockets, both tensioners and guides), thinking that even if there was damage, I'd want a new timing set on a used motor anyway right?

I put the timing set on, and tested compression. 199psi across all 4 cylinders! (factory spec) I slapped it back together, and she ran great. A little noise at startup, but nothing I was concerned with.

I drove the heck out of it, and after another 4000-4500 miles, I put 4 brand new tires and a new radiator in it. (old rad had a hairpin crack that was leaking) I drove it maybe 2-300 miles after the radiator, and one evening it lost all power and died (in the exact same intersection that it died for my wife). I cranked it, and heard the familiar hollow sound. I called up a buddy, and he brought his Excursion and towed me back home. I pulled the valve cover, and it was like I went back in time. The exact same thing happened! (although it looks like a chain link stretched apart, rather than just exploding)

Being pissed at the thing, and not knowing what I wanted to do with it, I let it set all year. I read the thread on here where a guy did the same thing I did, and bought the $90 complete timing set off ebay, and the exact same thing happened to him. He bought quality parts, put his back together and has been smooth sailing ever since. After reading that, I bought the same high quality parts he did, and put them in. (PCI from partsdinosaur.com, For sure better quality--thicker sprockets, thicker chains, etc...) After getting her back together, she runs, but has some nasty noises going on. I think it's bent valves, but a few people I talk to don't.

Facts:

-Very noisy at idle
-Runs great!--I've driven it 100+ miles since putting the new timing components on
-Seems to have plenty of power (hard to tell after driving the V8 Jeep)
-Accelerates well
-I left the valve cover off for 8+ months, so the cams and valvetrain were open to the elements under the hood for that long
-noises appear to be coming from right inside the intake manifold-area of the head


I drove it about 40 miles and took a video. Then I poured 1/2 quart of Lucas stabilizer in there, and drove it another 40-50 miles, and took another video. Today when doing a complete oil+filter change, I noticed that the noises seem to disappear around 2500 rpm and up. (see 3rd video) (note, it has 4.88 gears and runs 3000rpm|removethispart|@70mph)

Here's the 3 videos. Notice how you can't even hear it in the cab. (not sure how to embed on this site)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9--a...3&feature=plcp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8lv...2&feature=plcp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2OX...1&feature=plcp




What do you guys think? Bent valves? What boggles me is that it idles smooth, runs good, has power, but sounds like a diesel. (it shouldn't sound like a diesel)

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Offline nprecon

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2012, 09:21:18 AM »
The links didn't work for me on my end.  Are you sure you didn't jump a tooth when installing the chains?
'02 Chezuki Tracker with a 2 Liter and 5spd.  It works for me!!!

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Offline narnwv

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2012, 09:22:51 AM »
Are you sure you didn't jump a tooth when installing the chains?

I'm 99% positive. I guess I should tear it all back down and take another look though.

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Offline nprecon

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2012, 09:27:57 AM »
Another thought.  These trucklets are notorious for noisy lifters.  It sat for about a year so it stands to reason a lifter or two may have lost its prime.  Is the sound you are hearing a LIFTER/s that hasn't pumped back up yet?  Does the noise disappear after the truck has ran for a couple minutes?
'02 Chezuki Tracker with a 2 Liter and 5spd.  It works for me!!!

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Offline nprecon

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2012, 09:33:05 AM »
Did you send your head to a machine shop to seat the valves and clean it while it was off?   You could also take it to a garage and have them do a compression bleed down test on each cylinder versus a compression test.  If you have jacked up valve seats a bleed down test could point you to where the problem/s is. 
'02 Chezuki Tracker with a 2 Liter and 5spd.  It works for me!!!

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Offline narnwv

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2012, 09:57:17 AM »
Another thought.  These trucklets are notorious for noisy lifters.  It sat for about a year so it stands to reason a lifter or two may have lost its prime.  Is the sound you are hearing a LIFTER/s that hasn't pumped back up yet?  Does the noise disappear after the truck has ran for a couple minutes?

No lifters on the DOHC 2.0 right?

The noise stays no matter what the engine temp, although it does seem like it stumbles a weeee bit when cold.

Did you send your head to a machine shop to seat the valves and clean it while it was off?   You could also take it to a garage and have them do a compression bleed down test on each cylinder versus a compression test.  If you have jacked up valve seats a bleed down test could point you to where the problem/s is. 

I never removed the head. I have a friend who's coming by sometime this week with a leakdown test kit so we can do a leakdown test.


Thanks for the input guys, keep it coming!

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Online fordem

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2012, 12:13:31 PM »
Let's just say the only gasolene engines without lifters are two strokes & rotaries - what ever name you want to call them by, lifters, tappets, cam followers - if the engine has valves and a cam shaft, it has them, and since the 2.0 DOHC has a cam shaft (or two), it has them - hydraulic, self adjusting lifters, which just might be where the noise is coming from.
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Offline nprecon

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #7 on: September 16, 2012, 04:03:39 PM »
The 2Liter's lifters are short and squat little puppies!
'02 Chezuki Tracker with a 2 Liter and 5spd.  It works for me!!!

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Offline narnwv

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #8 on: September 16, 2012, 06:43:50 PM »
UPDATE:

I tore it back down this evening.  Found the key that goes in the crank to be a bit mangled.  It WAS NOT like that when I installed the timing set.



The part that's 1/2 as wide as it should be is the part that slides into the crank timing sprocket.  There was at least 1/8" (1/32-1/16 of a rotation) of play between the crank and the sprocket.

I put the key in backwards, thicker end first, and started rotating it with a wrench.  It seems to bind on the intake stroke of the 3rd cylinder, and something up front (seems to be the tensioner or intake cam) pops and then there's no resistance until it gets back around to that point again.

I'm going to pull the timing components off tomorrow evening and triple check everything. 

1st QUESTION:  Do you guys see a problem in me re-using the "1 time use" metal gasket for the upper tensioner?  That tensioner has to come off to get the upper chain off.  You can't get just the gasket.  It only comes with a $90 tensioner.  Dealer doesn't even sell it separately. 

2nd QUESTION:  do you guys think the dealer is going to be the only place to get that crank key?

3rd QUESTION:  Since there's binding, and I've run it quite a bit, do you think I bent a valve or screwed something up?  The mashed crank key has me worried.....

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Offline nprecon

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2012, 07:34:09 AM »
The torque spec on the crank shaft pulley bolt is pretty stiff - 109 lb ft.  Did you get it torqued properly during the first reassembly?
« Last Edit: September 17, 2012, 09:40:57 AM by nprecon »
'02 Chezuki Tracker with a 2 Liter and 5spd.  It works for me!!!

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Offline talonxracer

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #10 on: September 17, 2012, 09:31:31 AM »
The crank bolt must not have been properly installed or a stretched one was re-used, that is the only way the crank pulley can move around and mangle the key.

with the valve cover being open for so long exposed to the elements, I can just about gaurantee you have a collapsed lifter.

Never reuse a metal gasket
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Offline narnwv

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #11 on: September 17, 2012, 12:23:23 PM »
The crank bolt must not have been properly installed or a stretched one was re-used, that is the only way the crank pulley can move around and mangle the key.

with the valve cover being open for so long exposed to the elements, I can just about gaurantee you have a collapsed lifter.

Never reuse a metal gasket

I don't believe the crank pulley bolt was torqued down all the way. (whoops)

I picked up a new key for the crank at the dealer.  The gasket is confirmed discontinued by Chevrolet.  Suzuki can get it, although the guy swore up and down that because I had a Chevy Tracker, Suzuki parts wouldn't fit. 

I'm still having a hard time figuring out why a piece of metal can only be used as a gasket once.

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Offline nprecon

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #12 on: September 17, 2012, 01:42:59 PM »
Alot of owners have had the experience of a Chevy parts man swearing their truck parts 'aren't interchangeable with Suzuki trucks.'  I had a steering box go out of my '94 Sidekick daily driver.  Suzuki wanted $1200 for a new one... a local Chevy dealer had a steering box on the shelf for a similar year Geo/Tracker  for $900.  They claimed it would't fit my Sidekick AND that they had a 15% restock fee if it didn't.  I ended up buying the Chevy steering box, which bolted right in, and was driving again same day.
'02 Chezuki Tracker with a 2 Liter and 5spd.  It works for me!!!

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Offline narnwv

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #13 on: September 17, 2012, 08:33:54 PM »
Ended up not needing the gasket.  I KNEW I had the timing marks lined up.

Anyway, got the new crank key in.   It's near silent, except for a pulley bearing.   

I took it for a short drive.  It seems like it had more power when it was making all the racket?!?!?  Don't know what that's all about.

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Offline nprecon

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Re: 2000 Tracker 2.0 Timing chain nightmares
« Reply #14 on: September 18, 2012, 08:18:32 AM »
Hope it runs a few hundred thousand miles for you.
'02 Chezuki Tracker with a 2 Liter and 5spd.  It works for me!!!