Once again, I gotta ask an LPG related question.

I need to resolve the timing issue from running straight LPG. My problem is, I live in Perth (Western Australia) not a single business within 3000 miles knows how to recurve a dizzy anymore... it's getting to be old technology.

What are my options?  Are there any aftermarket solutions that offer adjustable timing curves?

I have been searching for an old "Sun" distributor machine for years,
Guys that have them, would sell off family first!

also different springs were used to change fly weights, but would check if your ECU controls that now.

CAPT

Oh, FYI, I run a 1990 Sierra (Sammy).  There's not CPU's or ECU's... all adjustments are made with a screwdriver 

Dude, you are way over thinking this issue, there have been thousands of
propane and dual fuel conversions done here in the states, just swap your
fuel over and kick the dizzy a few * more advance to take advantage of the
higher octane fuel and be done with it.

The only way you are going to get any better distributor advance curve is
with extensive engine dyno tuning with some trial and error, take the proven
Suzuki dizzy, and the curve they gave it and run it, unless you have deep
pockets to pull out of for all this tuning

What is petrol per liter these days Down Under? When I was there in 87'
it was $.59AU that was like $2.35/Gal, while here in the States it was
about $.99US

Wild

Yeah LPG is up to 70c per litre... bummer   still half price of any other fuel here though... Diesel or petrol (gas) is at least $1.50 per litre.  Outside city limits this rises pretty fast.  Waaay outside city limits these prices can triple.


I'm trying to point the finger at a running issue I have.  On the forums over here in Aus they're saying it's the LPG timing.  I did advance the dizzy 3 degrees to suit the fuel upon install - but it seems if I adjust it for around the town driving, it's average on the highway - vice-versa if I get it running well at high RPM, lower RPM/idle is not quite right.  Out wheeling I kinda like the whole rev range to be useable.

Seeing i'm aways through an LPG specific rebuild of a 1.3 for my car, I want to see if this is a problem I can solve.  I'm just not sure what effect on motor lifespan a timing curve that is only right 3/4 of the time will have.

Put it this way - some places I go I need a no fail, 100% reliable motor.  If it shyts itself there's no ability to communicate without the aid of a satellite phone... even with a satellite phone - if my motor fails, the car has no chance of recovery.  Even in a convoy, you'd have to leave the car behind.  For example - In the photo below, the nearest hardware store is 500 miles away - the nearest mechanic 800 miles.  Cell phones or mobile internet?  hahahahaha



If I can be assured that a timing issue won't be my downfall, i'll pay it no attention again.  But, nobody else I know runs LPG in their zook so you gotta ask too many questions rather than not enough.

I like that photo, it is awesome....... where is this beautiful place at down there?

Seriously, I wouldn't run propane on a distance / adventure rig. Your range is severely decreased and you loose all that valuable storage space in the back of the Samurai. Plus, when you're out in the boonies you want to use the most common fuel possible to increase your chances of finding a source. Are you really going to transfer LPG or borrow a bottle from a buddies rig in your caravan to continue? Would anyone else have that fuel available? A 5 gallon gerry can on the back full of gas or diesel takes up a lot less space and will get you another 100 miles. Has anyone even hung a spare LPG tank on the back of a vehicle?

Just an opinion, I hope it helps.

On the timing, if you want a dizzy recurved, I've used a place in Albany, Oregon... I'm sure you could ship one to them and get it recurved to the specs you request. 

or maybe these guys could do it? They're "local" http://www.performanceignition.com.au/


-Eric

Well, my zook has taken me to the eastern, southern and western most points of Australia.  I've also crossed the highest passable road in the Victorian Alps, and i've been to Ayers Rock in the dead centre of the outback.  My latest tour took me from Brisbane to Perth via the entire southern coast (BTW the pic above is taken ~100 miles east of Eucla, at the Great Southern Bight)... a 4000 mile journey, all on LPG. 

I arrived in Perth two weeks ago, and last weekend gave my zook a good thrash out at the local testing ground, the power lines 50 miles of dusty rocky ruts - with some other guys in my car club - look how crossed up and flexed out the big boys get on this little rut... I got 215's and no lockers and made it easy:




I'll never give up my zook, and it'll only get the best treatment from me.   Perfect timing is what I want, and if I can sort it out, she'll get it.

Well, my zook has taken me to the eastern, southern and western most points of Australia.  I've also crossed the highest passable road in the Victorian Alps, and i've been to Ayers Rock in the dead centre of the outback.  My latest tour took me from Brisbane to Perth via the entire southern coast (BTW the pic above is taken ~100 miles east of Eucla, at the Great Southern Bight)... a 4000 mile journey, all on LPG. 

I

I'll never give up my zook, and it'll only get the best treatment from me.   Perfect timing is what I want, and if I can sort it out, she'll get it.

That's really cool man.. I haven't experienced or heard of anyone going the distance with LPG and I certainly didn't mean any disrespect. Do you have photos of your rig doing this obsticle or going to those places? That all sounds very interesting.

-ERic

All good Mr Ebewley    I didn't know anybody that thought LPG was a good idea on a zook - but do the research, know the availability, stay within range of your limits (albeit I have a 350 mile range on one tank), and you can find some amazing places.  And there's nothing more enjoyable than showing up a $50K Landcruiser, he he

I've got no pics of my car out on that occasion (no action pics anyway), was my first time out with the club so took more photos of all the other zooks, never seen so many... i'll post them up in the appropriate section once I learn to orientate the forum a little better. Here's a 3/4 of the zooks that were still around at days end, some of these guys really know how to drive, I felt like an amateur:



I'll try those leads you gave me too.  It'd be so nice to have a car that starts easily, and no awful knock above 4000RPM... I can't have both with my current timing curve it seems.  It'd be nice to have an exhaust system last more than three months without cracking welds, melting down cat convs and rubber mounts... the passing heat is causing too much stress on long runs... I will solve this puzzle

Sounds like you might have a bad distributor and just need to have yours
rebuilt, and then if you were going to be way out you might want to carry
a spare dizzy for good measure, along with any other spares you might need
like T-case mounts and U-joints.

Wild

Is the mechanical advance that is built into the dizzy free. Are the springs on the weights under your breaker plate? Sometimes the mechanical advance gets frozen in place so you set the timing at idle and as engine speed increases the timing doesn't advance so the engine has no power in mid upper range. Then you advance timing and it runs better and you advance more but then idle gets poor because to much base timing. When you have your dizzy cap off can you turn your ignition rotor back and forth? Does it move freely? Do you have a timing light with a timing knob on it so you can rev the engine to check total timing. I would think that you should see at least 30 degrees of total timing when reved to full advance.

Looking at your pics and reading the list of places you've takin' that thing, all I can say is good on ya mate! That's some freakin adventure your on.

...  It'd be so nice to have a car that starts easily, and no awful knock above 4000RPM... I can't have both with my current timing curve it seems.  It'd be nice to have an exhaust system last more than three months without cracking welds, melting down cat convs and rubber mounts... the passing heat is causing too much stress on long runs... I will solve this puzzle

Hmmm... the "awful knock" above 4,000 indicates you have too much mechanical advance.  The hard starting indicates too much static advance.  Too much heat in the exhaust is pretty common for LPG rigs.  I burned up a set of valves in a 5.0l Ford on LPG because they were not sodium cooled.  If your timing is too advanced you will probably have more exhaust heat than normal.

I have to ask a stupid question here, since I am not familiar with sammi distributors.  Do you have vacuum advance?  If you do, and it is malfunctioning, you may have knocking when you are starting and when you hit the throttle hard with knocking.

When I had LPG installed on my 5.0 Ford, the tuner recurved the advance curve to come on earlier.  IIRC, he also disconnected the vacuum advance and we timed the static timing a few degrees advance.  I know all this head scratching of mine is not helping much, but it would appear you need to get a hold of an LPG tuning specialist and have him recurve your dizzy to LPG requirements.  It certainly should not be knocking at any rpm.  My LPG rig ran way smoother than it did on petrol.  Fuel mileage was about 15 percent less than on petrol, but part of the problem was I ran a "dual fuel" kit and they are not quite as efficient as LPG only.

Good luck with the problem.

Gil

I'm going to speek with a friend of mine tomorrow and see if he can come up with anything. He has run LPG in his for years with no problems, and this guy really likes his skinny pedal...