yea, they are probalby the crappiest looking manifolds I have ever seen in my life. not to mention these things have 3 catalytic converters when they are stock, mine only has two now though. my secondary cat was a high flow of some sort, but even after removing that I thought I felt a bit more throttle response. not much though. I imagine those two stock ones right off the manifolds are choking the crap out of it though