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GearLess Lockers....?

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95XL7

GearLess Lockers....?
« on: December 13, 2003, 02:12:48 AM »
Anyone using one of these lockers or have in the past? I want to buy one for my Tracker and don't want the lockrights because of the noise and ratcheting they make on corners(street). Says there front end capable too. I emailed them for a price and got a automated answer saying to call.....i hate that when company's do that!!! >:(

http://www.precisiongear.com/gearlesslocker.htm

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Offline Rhinoman

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Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2003, 03:51:28 AM »
I thought the gearless locker was just a myth ;D ;D If you find anything out (like if they really exist and prices) post it on here. I wouldn't mind trying one.
2000 Vitara 1.6, 3+3 Lift, 33"MTs, 5:83s, LWB brakes, Winch, Snorkel, Safari Rack
1986 SJ413K PickUp, 1.6L conversion.

OBD1 - Full diagnostics on a PC/Laptop: http://www.rhinopower.org

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Offline Natebert

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Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #2 on: December 13, 2003, 04:07:50 AM »
Looks like a mini-spool with clutches in the middle.  A.K.A. limited slip.  Has anybody used one of these?

~Nate

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95XL7

Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #3 on: December 13, 2003, 05:34:50 AM »
Quote
I thought the gearless locker was just a myth ;D ;D If you find anything out (like if they really exist and prices) post it on here. I wouldn't mind trying one.


They exist,power traxx makes one also,a guy on ebay had one for sale this summer and i missed out on it.
Problem is these company's don't post there prices so you have to call,otherwise you would just find the cheapest online and buy it. I think the last time i checked the power traxx unit was 399. , thats the prices i see for other applications too. But i think the gearless unit is slightly cheaper? Oh and of course their not open on the weekends to call >:(

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Offline NY_SIDEKICKER

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Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #4 on: December 13, 2003, 07:21:23 AM »
YEA DON'T YOU JUST HATE THAT! WORK ALL WEEK WITH NO ACCESS TO PHONE & MOST PLACES ARE CLOSED ON WEEKENDS  :-/  

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Offline Rhinoman

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Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #5 on: December 13, 2003, 08:38:52 AM »
Well I'm probably at home when they're at work so I can call, its a bit pricy though. Anyone got any phone numbers/know any other companies?
2000 Vitara 1.6, 3+3 Lift, 33"MTs, 5:83s, LWB brakes, Winch, Snorkel, Safari Rack
1986 SJ413K PickUp, 1.6L conversion.

OBD1 - Full diagnostics on a PC/Laptop: http://www.rhinopower.org

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Offline Natebert

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Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2003, 12:48:07 PM »
Does anybody have one or know of anybody that has one of these?  How do they perform?  How do they work mechanically?

~Nate

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95XL7

Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2003, 02:17:16 AM »
Ok, I did some digging and some places say the gearless is discontinued?? Some websites say the Powertrax no-slip is available but to call for more info? Upon looking at Calmini's V-6 Vitara project it says that their using a gearless locker in the rear? if so you would think they would sell them? Maybe Eric knows more about this....Hint Hint? ???

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Offline Mikerpm4x4

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Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2003, 01:19:14 PM »
Im quite sure they discontinued them because they had too many failures. I remember hearing that somewhere... I dont recall where but I do remember hearing it.

Mike
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95XL7

Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2003, 09:04:06 AM »
 :'( :'( :'( No gearless lockers....they made them but discontinued all models,unless you can find one stocked that wasn't sold. No go on the powertrax no-slip model also :-/ :-/

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Offline Mike71

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Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2003, 03:58:52 PM »
how does the locker have no gears? dont u have to have gears to transfer the motion from the tranny to the logitudenal axel? i might have used the wrong worg

like the tranny goes one way and the axel another so dont u need gears to make that switch?
623hp kb cobra sold! 100hp kick new DD :P

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Offline wildgoody

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Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #11 on: December 15, 2003, 04:16:58 PM »
An auto trans has clutches, gears too but only in the lower gears
final drive is 1:1 and OD is a gear too I guess, but it could be clutches
instead of gears, Ohh this replaces the spider gears, not the R&P .
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Offline Mike71

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Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #12 on: December 15, 2003, 04:24:15 PM »
so its gearles but theres still gears in it???????? wow i think i need a nap im lost lol
623hp kb cobra sold! 100hp kick new DD :P

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Offline 97TRAKIN

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Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #13 on: December 15, 2003, 09:39:34 PM »
Quote
so its gearles but theres still gears in it???????? wow i think i need a nap im lost lol

The ring and pinion don't count as part of the locker.
Here is a pic of the thing, see NO GEARS!

And here is a write up by Randy Lyman on it, I hope this helps.
Kind of long but informative.

For those of you who are interested in new mechanical designs, or more traction with fewer side effects, the Gearless Locker is more than just a little interesting. Trac-Tech started with the simple idea of the EZ Locker and has taken it even one step further towards simplification and smoother operation. Everyone from off-road fanatics to those who only need extra traction once in while will want to consider the new Gearless Locker.

The overall results of the Gearless Locker is that it's operation is the same as the Detroit Locker without the extra backlash. The unit drives both tires unless the vehicle is negotiating a turn, in which case it allows the outside wheel speed to override the inside wheel speed so that the tires do not have to scuff, or be dragged around the turn. The free-wheeling side re-engages and drives again as soon as the inside tire speed catches back up with the freewheeling side when the vehicle completes a turn, or the inside tire spins and reaches the same speed as the outside tire. The only side effects are strange handling in short wheel-base vehicles while negotiating sharp turns under power, and the spinning of the inside tire while taking off from a stop sign, while turning, when the road is slippery.


Finally, the long awaited and unexplained Gearless Locker is explained. The details may seem complicated at first, but read them a few times and give the information a few days to sink in before reading it again. Many readers will probably figure it out and say "why didn't I think of that?"

And the obvious question is "how does it do that?" The whole key to the operation of the Gearless Locker is the "Tunkenel-V" ramp. (is this a goofy name or what?) The force of the cross pin shaft on the Tunkenel V ramp produces a separating force between the cross pin shaft and the V ramp as the shaft attempts to ride up the ramp. This separating force on the V ramp causes a clamping force on the friction clutches, which locks the side gear to the case as the clutches engage and drives the axle, which drive the wheel. If any force causes the wheel to go faster than the ring gear that is driving it, the results of the overriding speed of the wheel will cause the force on the V ramp to decrease, and the clutches will disengage allowing the overriding wheel to free-wheel until the overriding force causing the wheel to turn faster than the ring gear is gone (when the vehicle completes the turn). This may seem complex, but read it through a few times and then give it a few days to sink in before reading it again.

The idea of clutches may bring up concerns of chatter or wear. Unlike clutches in most applications, these clutches lock instantaneously and do not slip at all (which makes the unit work without the extra backlash associated with other lockers). They also release instantly when any overriding forces are created while negotiating a turn. This instant release design does not allow for any chatter whatsoever. Additionally, Trac-Tech states that in all of their extensive testing they have had no indication of clutch wear, and in fact, they provide a bottle of special additive to keep the clutch surfaces from galling due to the excellent loading of the friction clutches.

Installation of the Gearless Locker is pretty easy and straight forward. Most backyard mechanic will be able to install the unit on a long afternoon or at worst, over the weekend. Some models require removing the ring gear from the carrier, but none of them require any shimming. Like the EZ Locker from Trac-Tech, and the Lock-right from Powertrax, the Gearless Locker simply replaces the standard spider gears in a non-locking differential and works with the stock carrier case and the stock c-clips.

The first units to be released will be for the AMC Model 20 & Model 35, Dana 30, Dana 44, Ford 9", Suzuki, and for several Toyota applications.

These will work well in both the front and the rear just like other lockers. I know that a lot of readers are reluctant to try a locker in the front. I have driven vehicles with front lockers and find them to be fairly well mannered. I believe that the few small changes in handling are worth the gain in traction, and using a locker will allow the unlocking of one hub for better steering during steep off-camber maneuvers.

For the record I (97TRAKIN) take no credit for this article. It belongs to Randy Lyman.



« Last Edit: December 15, 2003, 09:47:01 PM by 97TRAKIN »

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95XL7

Re: GearLess Lockers....?
« Reply #14 on: December 15, 2003, 10:02:10 PM »
I guess they were having troubles with some of the applications and decided to discontinue the whole line :-/

Wish they would have continued the applications that didn't have problems or low HP applications like our rigs.