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My drive axle is falling out

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Offline jihe

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My drive axle is falling out
« on: February 05, 2011, 01:47:41 AM »
Hi, first post here.

My 2005 GV has never had 4wd working under my ownership. The cause has been the front axle not locking. Last week I started searching for the problem. I thought that the problem was with the air actuator, so i lifted the differential down and split it.

Nothing seems wrong with the actuator, it locks nicely when I apply air pressure. The problem was with the right drive axle that had stripped its splines. It has at some point pulled out of the diff and rubbed against the femal splines when retracted. The locking ring was still there, buried under the forged splines. The female splines looked fine.

So I bought a new (used) drive axle and put it all together last night thinking that I would finally have it fixed.

But on the first test drive that 4wd would not work anyway! Crawling under the car I discovered the reason: The new axle had also popped out of the diff and was now hanging on only the nylon bushing (my car seems to have had this put in at some time) and the seal.

Why is this happening? Are there different lenghts of drive axles for different cars? My car has a 2.0 petrol engine and automatic transmission. I could not find a similar car at any breaker, so the one I got came from a 2.7 automatic. The axle was the same length as my old, but I was thinking if it had possibly been replaced earlier so my old was short too?

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Offline jihe

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Re: My drive axle is falling out
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2011, 04:26:20 AM »
Working on it now. It was possible to push it in again, with a click when seated. But it does not need much force to pull out again, just a light pry with a screwdriver. I did not use a new locking ring since everything suzuki is at least a week delivery here. I wonder how much difference that would have made?

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Offline BRD HNTR

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Re: My drive axle is falling out
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2011, 06:58:09 AM »
What year did your new/used CV come off?  Is your GV lifted?  With a spring/spacer lift the CV's are running in an extended position.  Does it have Diff drop brackets?  How tight is the left side with the A arm in a normal position?  It should have a small gap available for flexing, when the bolts are removed. 
93 Tracker,XL7 springs & 1" raised spring pads in front with YJ springs in back, home built bumpers rear & front (w/winch), 2" x 4" rock tubes,  ARB front & rear, converted Sami rear to IFS, 33x12.5x15  aluminum rims, roll cage, 2.7L w/5 speed auto.

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Offline Novadon

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Re: My drive axle is falling out
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2011, 07:48:32 AM »
Quote
Is your GV lifted?
That's what I'm thinking too. If so, I've seen spacer needs to acquire a new (corrected) shaft length.
99' Suzuki Grand Vitara, 2.5, 4wd, 5spd.
72 Nova, SB, A/C, Power disk/drum & steering,
03' Honda Odyssey

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Offline jihe

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Re: My drive axle is falling out
« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2011, 11:47:17 AM »
Not lifted, and the replacement comes from a vehicle made the same year as mine.

But I think I may have located the problem now. When I replaced the oil seal on the right side I put it in flush with the housing, because that's the way the old one was done. But today I noticed that the ring on the CV joint is touching the seal, so I started thinking and reading.

In the workshop manual it says that the depth is determined by marks on a special tool from Suzuki. Didn't say how deep, but at least that indicated that flush was wrong. After some googling on my cell phone I found someone who had measured his ring to be 3 mm deeper than the outside of the housing. That will surely make the shaft seat deeper and hopefully let the locking ring expand more. I will try that tomorrow, tonight I had to turn a tool on my lathe since I couldn't find a suitable 62/50 mm ring to push the seal in with.

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Offline BRD HNTR

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Re: My drive axle is falling out
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2011, 07:40:36 AM »
A TOOL, a LATHE, I want to work on my Tracker in your shop.  I just use a suitably sized socket.  I believe the seals in aluminum cases are slightly inset.  Just goes to show what reading will do for you.  Post some photo's when you are setting it.
93 Tracker,XL7 springs & 1" raised spring pads in front with YJ springs in back, home built bumpers rear & front (w/winch), 2" x 4" rock tubes,  ARB front & rear, converted Sami rear to IFS, 33x12.5x15  aluminum rims, roll cage, 2.7L w/5 speed auto.

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Offline jihe

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Re: My drive axle is falling out
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2011, 01:44:40 PM »
A TOOL, a LATHE, I want to work on my Tracker in your shop.
I don't think so, there is lots of snow on the driveway where I have to work  :-\ The lathe is indoors, but no place for the GV here.

Anyway. The seal was not the problem and the text in the manual was outdated. Since my axle has had the nylon bushing put in at some time the seal needs to sit flush with the outer surface. The real problem was that the new shaft was NOT the same length. My measurement with the boots on was too sloppy. With both shafts laid out side by side and measured fully compressed and pulled out there is actually 15 mm difference between them :-(

So now I need to find another one at some breaker. If Suzuki only had an EPC that I could actually understand so I could compare part numbers from different models...
« Last Edit: February 06, 2011, 01:46:43 PM by jihe »

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Offline IanL

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Re: My drive axle is falling out
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2011, 12:47:22 AM »
If Suzuki only had an EPC that I could actually understand so I could compare part numbers from different models...

My EPC allows me to see the different Part #s for the 2 litre and the XL7 - the front axles are different numbers.  Do you mean it doesn't tell you what the differences are?
'98 GV V6, '96 X-90 with RRO 2.5" lift and 195/80 R15, '93 Cappuccino.

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Offline jihe

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Re: My drive axle is falling out
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2011, 01:53:04 PM »
It probably does if I can understand how. I can't find information about what model I have to begin with. I guess it could be one of the SQ420* models since I have a 2 litre engine. But is it SQ420Q (99-00 CAMI) E02,21,22, SQ420V,  SQ420V-2,  SQ420X-2,  SQ420X-3,  SQ420XD-3,  SQ420Q (01-04 CAMI) E02,21,22,  SQ420W,  SQ420WD,  SQ420W-2,  SQ420WD-2,  SQ420W3, or SQ420WD-3? Ok, I guess I can rule out the first one, my car is built 2004.

But I received a new shaft in the mail today from a breaker, and it is of the correct length. But they had ruined the groove for the locking ring when they pulled it from the axle, so I'll have to return it and find another...  again :(

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Offline BRD HNTR

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Re: My drive axle is falling out
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2011, 03:44:14 PM »
You can swap the CV joints on the axles, its not any harder than what you have already done.  A LOT greasier, but it works if you have a good end.  Getting the wire clamp back in position is tricky.  I haven't had any problems with one that I did.
93 Tracker,XL7 springs & 1" raised spring pads in front with YJ springs in back, home built bumpers rear & front (w/winch), 2" x 4" rock tubes,  ARB front & rear, converted Sami rear to IFS, 33x12.5x15  aluminum rims, roll cage, 2.7L w/5 speed auto.

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Offline jihe

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Re: My drive axle is falling out
« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2011, 11:20:19 AM »
You can swap the CV joints on the axles, its not any harder than what you have already done.  A LOT greasier, but it works if you have a good end.  Getting the wire clamp back in position is tricky.  I haven't had any problems with one that I did.
Yes - if I had one with a good end. The first I received had different splines than the original in the joint, and the second was damaged. Fortunately the breaker where I got the last one had one more, so now it's on the way in the mail without me having to send in the old one.

I almost hope I'll wear out an outer joint some day - now that I have three spares!