ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Suzuki 4x4 Forum => Topic started by: zaggy on June 29, 2005, 10:05:29 AM
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So heres the problem.....
  I finished the engine on the "Do it yerself engine" thread and got so excited about doing it I didn't think about what I was going to put it in...oops
So now I've got.....
1) 1.6/8v in the airplane.
2) Partner is putting the 1.6/8v that was going in
  Kick/Track for my daughter into the airboat
3) I've got to finish the 2.0L swap for my wifes SideKick
  4dr and get it installed.
4) The 1.6/16v from my wifes is being redone to go into
  the Kick/Track for my daughter.
  So all my engines have homes and all the projects will be cleaned up by September.....
EXCEPT this one.............so now what do I build.
  I live in Alberta and haven't yet got into this rock crawling stuff....but I'd like some ideas for a home for this engine so I can test it and develope more info....
Any thoughts?????
Has to be cheap, shouldn't have built it in the first place.
Thanks
Zag
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2wd pavement pounder. slam it a bit, stick that engine in there and pimp it. seriously. 8)
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wheeling rig, mabey some of that IFS stuff you have been talking about in the other threads.
stu
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find a rusty ol samurai, put the beast motor in, and have a good ol wheel time :)
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Hey Zag...I have a rusted body parts Tracker that you can make a buggy out of...I'm on the east end of Edmonton if you're interested.
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Thanks for the input guys
I'm still open to ideas so keep them coming....
Prd2BCDN.....I'll get a hold of you when I'm cash recovered.
Thanks
Zag
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Get 2 Old track/kicks, maby a samy gear box, revers the gears form one of the front ends and put it in the back, Maby run all wheel stearing, locking hubs front and rear, 4WIS and run 31 in tires, you could probably put a steel housing Of the rear axel and use the shaft hausing - half shafts - and CV axels from the fron and have a pretty strong piece. would take a bit of FAB and Some welding but you would have a strong motor, KIK ARSE drive trane, 4 wheel stearing is not that hard to rig up, 2 power gear boxes, or 2 manual gear boxes.
And 4 wheel stearing, you could drive in perfect circles, and probably do cookies in a garauge!!
oh yeah gota have a snorkel, roll cage on this,
I am not talking rock crawler, thoe it could but would need more then stock parts. "anvil housings stronger axels, Yoda fron end parts" but it would be a VERRY capable trail Rig and to put a locker in either fron or rear, or BOTH.
this is somthing i want to do but at the moment i dont have a shop, welder cutting torch, or the cash.
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Did you say airboat? Lemme see, Lemme see!
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Thanks for the input guys
  I'm still open to ideas so keep them coming....
Prd2BCDN.....I'll get a hold of you when I'm cash recovered.
Thanks
Zag
Cash? Who's talkin' cash? I just want it outta my driveway ;)
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AHHHHH! How come the free trackers are in Edmonton??? I'd love to have that to start a Tough Truck buildup
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I think he is refering to, if it is sitting arround, he will likley start working on it.
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Prd2BCdn
Deal PM you Monday
Zag
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Prd2BCdn
  Deal PM you Monday
Zag
Okee-dokee :)
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Thanks Proud2BCdn
  I'll get a hold of you Monday.........
But the problem is still there, now what do I build? I've
got the engine, driveline and chassis......
Suggestions
Heres what I'm thinking........
I can't imagine me being a Rock Crawler (not that it ain't cool, but I don't know where in driving range I could do it and after look'n at those angles...I'd rather be flying when I get that twisted up)........soooooo
- European rally style Trail Screamer?
(lowered a titch, Meaty Tires, increase wheel travel,
lights etc)
- Slammed AWD Road Race Style machine?
(Lowered alot, BIG low profile tires, Flares, Airdam,
4.62:1 gears with a 5spd)
- Baja Pre Runner style Trail Unit?
What ever I do I want to keep it a street driver to do some follow up developement work that I talked about on the "do it yerself engine build" thread.
What do you guys think?
Zag
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how bout just a normal every day trail rig with some cool tricks and stuff? you don't have to have it totally planed out, just go by feel ;D
stu
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I like the idea of the dropped road racer ;)
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I'm kinda leaning toward the AWD road racer simply because I've never seen it done.
It would also make a great test bed for engine mods as you could do 0-60 runs on any hiway rather than looking for a special place to test
That or the Euro rally stye machine.
1BigTracker
I always pre plan what I'm going to build so that I have time to scrounge parts (engine project excepted).
One of the reason's I'm leaning the way I am is that I have flares from one of my race cars, I have four point harnesses, low profile tires, lots of body parts for rust repair and a pile of experience in building RWD and FWD road racers. We also have my wifes 4dr that will be a good trail machine for what we do, especially after I get the 2.0 swap done.
Zag
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RallyKick!!!!!!!!!!
;D
Cwkick
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Rally with 4WIS!!
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Take the 4.12 out of the an automatic, match them up with the motor you build and a manual tranny, get a little more topend 8) 8) Scrap or sell the rear end, and just get Reversed gears for a front end "not a necessity, but it will last longer with the pinion on the upper side of the ring gear"
and move it to the REAR, just have to make some Brackets and do a bit of welding to get the front end attached to the arse end, Either make 4 wheel steering, or weld the stearing
knuckels so they are straight " if you do this I recomend Rienforceing them, or building new arms, "really easy, just mock up with cardboard" Or you can make a Ti-rod and conect one end to the frame and the other to the steering arm.
I wish i had the resources to do this, i would then Chop a kick body, put an air dam on the hood, to make it slim.cut the back down mount the spar inside the rear, it might not be a crawler, but you could HAUL but!!
you know take about 2 inches out of the side panels and doors, then lower it a bit with some kinda stiff shocks, and with 4wis you could adjust you toe for all 4 wheels, and make that sucker coner like it was on a rail!!
ahh man that would rock
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Zig think about the 4WIS i could help you out with some of the desgin, i can measure the back fram of my track, and get mesurement for the front and give you an ideal of what would need to be done, and 4WIS would kik on the road and on off the road! But the transfer cas has low range gears in event in 4H, should get a swift tranny and mount the motor sideways, ahh then put the 4:12 gears in bet you could see some serious speed, and it would be altime allwheel drive.
but its your project but i will help with as much of the drawing / calculating as I can. might be able to get it mocked up in solid works, and send you a rendering for the computer.
but i dont know how much you want to do, but the more ive been thinking of this, im gona have a talk with my machinest buddy, and see if he wants to go in with me to build a rally buggy based on a kik. Maby with my floating 4WIS, but i want it to haul but and crawl, i duno im looking for parts, prices but LOL last thing i need is anouther project at the moment.
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I'm all about the rally model too, go for it!! The fully independent set up would definetly require some planning, but should be feasible and more than worth the time and effort.
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i'm gonna diagree with the folks who say go wild ...
put the build into the rusty kick, do the budget lift (spacers and BL), and go beat the piss outta it.
treat it as a test bed for the motor and have loads of fun for little $$$.
never know you might like grounded pucker factor :)
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hay put the motor in it beet the piss out of it then make it into somthing diffrent, rinse and repeat. but the AWIS would be kik arse, and would take lots of planing but i dont thing that much money, if you reused all the zuk parts you could, and just bought the gears, maby 500, but like i said befor, revers gears will just make it stronger, lots of people are running front diffs in the rear, without reversing the gears.
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you could also cut the rear axel, and make a linked axel out of it and not event have CVS in the back. but that requires lots of skill with welder and saw / torch be easer just to revers the front end onto the rear flip it and weld it to the Frame, and replace the gears when they brak.
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i'm gonna diagree with the folks who say go wild ...
put the build into the rusty kick, do the budget lift (spacers and BL), and go beat the piss outta it.
treat it as a test bed for the motor and have loads of fun for little $$$.
never know you might like grounded pucker factor :)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
i like that. and i think if you where going to test the engine and more mods after, you would want to keep it as simple as you could to get accurite(sp) results.
stu
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Hey Guys thanks for all the input....
  After talking with the family heres the direction the fleet is going...
1) Wifes 4dr
-  2.0L swap that I'm already building the parts for.
 (have already)
-  Little bigger tires (already have)
-  Skid plates (fabricate)
-  Some mean lights (fog and driving, already have)
ÂÂ
  This one will be the daily driver/trails and camping
2) Daughter's 2dr/2WD Soft top
  (already started, my 13yr old is doing as much work
   as me so she appreciates what she gets and
   knows how to fix it)
-  1.6/16v rebuilt, balanced/blueprinted, port matched
  intake mods, header and some other light weight stuff
  ( will use the one from wife's 4dr)
-  Lowered to 6" rocker panel clearance
-  Power steering (already have)
-  Modified KYB shocks
-  Double front sway bars, fabricate
-  Custom rear sway bar, fabricate
-  15X6" fronts with 195-50-15's (already have)
-  15X8" rears with  215-50-15's (already have)
-  Airdam, rear IMSA style body flares, fabricate
 This one is about 18months or more from being done as she HAS to work on it with me and is only worked on when she has time after homework and everything else.
 I think it will be a great first car, handle well and be cheap to run.
My project after much deliberation is going to be Dad's cheap skate test bed......
Pro Rally style.....
      I really like the name Rally-Kick!
Here's the reasoning.....
- Gonna have a good trail rig for the kinda stuff we do.
- Daughter is gonna have the Slammer
- Dad should get to have some fun!
- Car Club here has several Pro Rallys each spring
- Can still be an awesome trail rig.
- I like stiff good handling little rigs
The Plan....
- "do it yerself engine" exactly from the build up. (done)
- Body dropped a little (opposite of body lift), lower CofG
- Lowered a couple inches all around, lower CofG
- Double front sway bars, decrease body roll, fabricate
- Custom rear sway bar, decrease body roll, fabricate
- Modified KYB Rally Gas shocks
- Manual steering
- P215-60-15 Agressive All seasons (used)
- 4.62:1 gears front and rear
- Remains 4WD
- Locker when money permits (used)
- Interior gutted and Rhino Lined (the do it yerself stuff)
- Stock dash with tach and auxillary guages (already
 have)
- Lightweight front buckets with 4 points (already have)
- NO rear seats
- Roll Cage, fabricate, DIY
- Doors gutted, DIY
- Pexi windows, worked with straps and clips DIY
- Aluminum inner door panels DIY
- Basic am-fm-cassette (already have)
- Body repairs as needed (do it yerself)
- Old style Mustang GT bolt on hood scoop, functional
- Interior color Zinc chromate, DIY
- Exterior Olive drab based camoflauge, DIY
- 4 Driving lights across roof roll bar, Olive Drab
- 4 Fog lights across top of front bumper, Olive Drab
- Full front to rear skid plates
- Possible Roo Bar style front bumper
  I think this should be a great on-off road driver, I'll be able to do a little Pro Rally stuff. Not lowering it too much and skid plating the bottom front to rear should mean there ain't many obstacles that will be a problem for decent 4x4 work, within limits.
  I'll be able to go to the Drag strip to get accurate 1/4 mile times for testing and results. I might even be able to do a little Solo 1/ Solo 2 slalom stuff.
  Thanks to Prd2BCdn I've got a base chassis, I've got most of the parts and I should be able to really cheap skate this one together over a few months using maximum used and fabricated from stuff in the shop parts.
  I think I can do this one over the fall for very/very little money if I'm lucky. It won't be a show car but it will be presentable and fun.
  The goal is to match the weight of a stock base model Track/Kick and use as a test bed for engine perf stuff. As well as enter events that are being run around here.
  But if my business every gets good I'll be able to come down and do some 4x4 trails with the gang down South, with something different.
What do you guys think? Any suggestions.....
Should we do this as another "Build up" thread?
Zag
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Well the Turbo SideKick needs a little
fixxin up could you .........
;)
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Don' knock it you've got me thinkin turbo eventually...
Zag
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i like big tacks idea a normal everyday trail rig that could go mud or obstacle or rocks not amazing on all but good all round.....stay IFS tho....(i think we have to prove something) but quality and reliable
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Hey Guys
  After deliberating all weekend I'm sticking with the Rally Kick plan....only change, the guys at the Aviation Museum have convinced me to paint it like a CF-18 (US F-18 ) light/medium gray overall, Very dark gray lettering for all the military and aircraft markings...
Think I can do it real cheap and should be real cool....
Thanks for all the input guys
Zag
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2) Daughter's 2dr/2WD Soft top
  (already started, my 13yr old is doing as much work
   as me so she appreciates what she gets and
   knows how to fix it)
-  1.6/16v rebuilt, balanced/blueprinted, port matched
  intake mods, header and some other light weight stuff
  ( will use the one from wife's 4dr)
-  Lowered to 6" rocker panel clearance
-  Power steering (already have)
-  Modified KYB shocks
-  Double front sway bars, fabricate
-  Custom rear sway bar, fabricate
-  15X6" fronts with 195-50-15's (already have)
-  15X8" rears with  215-50-15's (already have)
-  Airdam, rear IMSA style body flares, fabricate
Zag
I want to see this one when it's done!
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Just got home from meeting with Prd2BCdn and the new (2 me) toy comes to the shop tommorow.
Happy Happy Joy Joy
Now Eric should this/could this be a project build?
Zag
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Would anybody be interested in following the build?
Zaggy
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I would follow it
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D i still think 4WIS ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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When I first came to this board, I was thinking of building a Tracker with IRS.  Basically it would be used as a high speed desert runner, but would have 4wd when needed.  The transfer case would get 6to1 gears to help the 31-32 inch tires, and also give you the lower gearing when crawling is required.  Install an air locker in the rear, and you could have rear steering brakes like a sand rail when the rear diff is open.
I was thinking of welding a rear torsion housing from a VW bug to the rear of the vehicle, (actually a modified version without torsion bars, and Fox air shocks or coil overs would be installed).  This modified version would allow the driveshaft to connect to the rear diff.  It could easily get 12 inches of rear travel, and up to 18 using 930 CVs with 4x5 trailing arms. ÂÂ
Or, it could be converted to a driveshaft version, instead of the CVs, and get up to 22 inches of travel in the rear.  This would cost alot more $$, and it would be one of those modifications that get done later down the road. ÂÂ
The only reason I'm thinking of ditching the idea, is because I don't think you can get a lot of travel out of the Tracker IFS.  It would almost have to be a dual Arm set up (like a Toyota) to get 12 inches of usable 4x4 travel without the risk of breaking CVs.  If I want to keep up with the VW BAJA guys, I need at least 10 inches of front suspension travel, 12 inches would be preferred.  Otherwise, they will leave me in the dust, because the front IFS could not absorb the bumps without bottoming out (front engine = lots of weight).
The rear diff is another issue.  I was thinking of shorten rear Toyota truck diff, rear Toyota Supra diff, or Corvette rear diff.  Regardless, the rear diff has to be as narrow as possible to allow maximum travel and also match the gearing in the front diff. ÂÂ
I think matching the front Tracker IFS with a IRS rear diff would require the most research.  So far, I think I'm better off using a stock 4wd Toyota instead of the Tracker  (Long Travel Toyota IFS Kits are already available).  But I like the looks of a Tracker better,  ;D  the Toyota truck frame would be heavier, and would have to be shorten to have a good break over angle if to be used with 31 inch tall tires. ÂÂ
The reason for IFS and IRS for me was to have a 4wd that could fly down the forest roads with the VW Baja guys, and have 4wd available for the local Zuk clubs. It might even ride like a caddy. ::)
Just trying kick around some ideas, I will be watching this build!  Maybe I will have to do some more research and find a way to make this work.
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Watch the RallyKick build up....
Your Ideas are similar to where I want to end up, I think I can do it with a live axle in the back using alot of the old rally car technology..........Super Quick trail Runner, Decent off road, fun at sports car club events.
Zag