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ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Build Diaries, How-To, DIY => Topic started by: crusty on July 20, 2015, 02:48:42 PM

Title: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 20, 2015, 02:48:42 PM
Well, the great website crash of 2015 wiped out my build, so I will start a thread again. I have been wanting a Samurai for about a decade, and around Christmas 2014 I decided to get serious. I had been building a Dodge crewcab, and it wasn't really going to suit my needs, so I sold it. I got lucky and got all my $$ back out of it. I took some and bought a fairly clean 87 Sami that needed some mechanical love. Here's a few pictures.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 20, 2015, 02:55:57 PM
Bear with me. Still figuring out how to post the pictures and stuff. Anyway, I got it home and gave it a look over. It wasn't bad, but most of the mechanical stuff had been neglected. The lady I got it from said it needed a head gasket, but it really needs going through. However, that had to go on hold because shortly after buying it, we bought a house. That took some time to get settled in, and the building I decided to adopt for a shop wasn't really set up right.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: ebewley on July 20, 2015, 07:10:53 PM
Thanks for restarting your thread. I look forward to seeing the updates.

-Eric
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 21, 2015, 08:26:45 PM
Ok, so about 2 weeks ago, I was finally able to tear into the Sami. Like I said, she said it needed a head gasket, but after looking it over and pricing just a head gasket, I talked myself into a reman engine. Sure, the gasket was cheap, but then I added in a timing belt, H2O pump, seals, etc and I had over half towards a reman, and it was still an old engine. I pulled it and started inspecting. I decided to buy a hose kit, new clutch, clutch cable, hood cable, and some misc seals. I then started degreasing everything.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 21, 2015, 08:33:46 PM
That pretty much brings me up to today. While degreasing I discovered some rust. Bear in mind, this thing is pretty clean, but apparently a leaking battery rusted the battery tray and firewall, and their cheap fix rusted through again.I am kind of a perfectionist, so I am dangerously close to turning a head gasket into a frame off :laugh: I decided to patch the firewall and maybe do the inner fender at some later time, since I just want it running again.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: nprecon on July 22, 2015, 04:21:05 AM
Yeah.... it's really hard to look at a patch of rust and not feel compelled to cut the cancer out and patch it with solid metal.  Rust is aggravating.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 22, 2015, 09:36:06 PM
 :laugh:Yeah, I failed. Hopefully, I will have a little more to update soon. As far as the engine, I have received my clutch, new hoses, new timingcover, and a bunch of seals from Low Range Offroad. The new engine should be in any day now, so I am hoping to get it put back together soon. I am just doing the rust repair while I wait.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 24, 2015, 08:41:24 PM
Couple of quick updates. First, I have received all the stuff I ordered, except for the engine. Second, I worked on the rust repair a little more. I found some old office furniture-type stuff, which was about the same thickness as the Sami body. It sure is much easier to manipulate than old Dodge and Ford sheetmetal :P The panels I am making are mostly formed by hand. That's a change. Next time I get out to the shop, I hope to tack it in. My plan is to spot tack it and then use seam sealer all around the edge. I am doing a lap splice, with about 1/2" overlap
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 24, 2015, 08:44:18 PM
Keep getting limited on pics. Here's some more.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 24, 2015, 08:50:59 PM
Not sure who's pics the 1st three are...or how they got in my post ???
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 26, 2015, 08:58:40 AM
This morning I got up at 5:30 and put in the patch panels. I tacked them in about every inch or so and then used Eastwood's seam sealer on both sides of the patch.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 26, 2015, 09:02:17 AM
Then I primed it with red metal primer. After that, I started to lay out my new silicone hoses and cleaned a little more. I am disappointed they didn't have black hoses. Oh well. With regards to cleaning, it is nice when the vehicle spews oil everywhere. Good protectant :laugh: The axle is covered with the factory paint.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on August 04, 2015, 08:16:57 PM
I had to run to Idaho to take care of some business, but I am back and can provide a little update. Some of this was done before I left, and some tonight. I painted the firewall patch, got word that I can finally pick up my engine tomorrow ;D The blue doesn't exactly match, but it is better than rust :laugh:
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on August 04, 2015, 08:24:36 PM
Rustoleum Hammered Black is probably my favorite paint to use. I buy the quarts and apply it with a cheap chip brush. Of course, technique matters :P Anyway, I like that it covers minor imperfections well, applies easily, and is wet looking glossy. Maybe it is the old machine shop look of hammered that I like :laugh: I don't know...

Anyway, I did the bottom radiator pipe, coolant pipe under the intake, and the trans shifter. By the time I'm done, probably a bunch more parts will be that color.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on September 07, 2015, 08:06:01 PM
I've been picking away at the new engine. I cleaned and painted a bunch. That sure is time consuming, but I like to do it so that if I have to revisit anything, it is less of a mess to work on.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on September 07, 2015, 08:10:07 PM
I also replaced all the vacuum hoses with new. This brings me to a question. When I got the sami, there were a couple things not right. First, is there a hose that connects to the nipple on the fuel pump. There are 4 total: supply, return, carb supply, and ?? Second, there is a vacuum hose that wasn't connected to anything. It sits on the pass most port under the dashpot? by the back of the carb. Where does it connect to?
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on September 09, 2015, 08:26:41 AM
Here's a few more pictures. I figured out the fuel pump one. The other comes from the top of the carb in the rear.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on September 09, 2015, 08:32:53 AM
Another
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on September 09, 2015, 07:49:21 PM
Nevermind. Adding coolant, I figured it out :P
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: Boxcar on September 10, 2015, 08:09:32 AM
 Wow . Those stray pics are of my Zuke .
Must be a ghost in the machine.....
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on September 10, 2015, 07:55:24 PM
Yeah, it was weird. It did happen shortly after the website was up again, so maybe that is what caused the glitch ???
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on September 12, 2015, 12:20:25 PM
As of this morning, it's alive! My timing was 1 tooth off, so I had to max the dist adjustment to get it to run. I got it roughly tuned, with no real problems so far. I have driven it up and down our road a few times, and I am quite pleased! The only thing so far is that it idles high, so I have some more carb tinkering to do
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: Boxcar on September 14, 2015, 08:20:41 AM
 Glad to here that you are back on the road. Looks like you are doing a fine job....
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on September 20, 2015, 07:20:02 AM
Thanks. I now have about 2 weeks of driving it, and have been finding a few small things that need attention. First, my coolant slowly leaks from the petcock. Not sure if I can just swap the o-ring? Second, it runs really rich. I have tuned the stock carb as much as I can, but it is still rich. It might be getting barely 20mpg. Ideas on how to lean it out?
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: Rhinoman on September 20, 2015, 01:57:44 PM
Did you fix the cam timing issue?
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on September 20, 2015, 08:59:37 PM
I set the timing belt fine. I got the distributor off by a tooth but corrected it. I plugged the vacuum to the dist and set the timing to 10 degrees. I am at about 300 ft elevation. I think the carb has an issue. It also idles really high, like 1600 rpm or so. These symptoms are why I think it is the carb, but I am open to ideas
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on September 21, 2015, 05:02:18 PM
Well, my MPG guesstimation was way off. I just filled the tank, calculated, and got 24.99 MPG :) Although I know it isnt exactly tuned right, I am happy with that. I feel that I could get 29 MPG once it is broke in and properly tuned. Due to the lack of adjustability of the factory carb, I am seriously considering a toyota swap, but that will have to wait.
Probably do the kingpins first ;)
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: Guntrain on October 04, 2015, 12:37:25 PM
Keep it coming!  Just picked up my first Sammy.  I'm in sponge mode.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: Boxcar on October 06, 2015, 10:55:12 AM
 When I was still running the Suzuki motors I exclusively ran the Toyota carbs. Averaged 29mpg on all 3 motors.
I highly recommend it..... The damn things will run upside down.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on October 10, 2015, 09:37:14 AM
Guntrain-welcome!

I am on hold for the toy carb for now. I need to redo the front kinpins, so that is priority. I have been driving the sami about 200 miles a week, and LOVE it! THe carb doe have some issues, but has been averaging about 26+ MPG now that I have gotten used to driving it. I have to cure the death wobble first, but then I am going to look at the toy carb again.

Right now I am installing a radio. Should have some pics soon.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on October 15, 2015, 06:16:25 PM
I finally got my pictures transferred to the computer. I have an old aluminum truck box I keep for small projects. It is worthless, but the aluminum is good for small things. I decided to ditch the cracked plastic radio face bracket and make one out of aluminum. I also dug in my stash and added a second lighter socket while I was at it. I don't particularly like crimp connectors, so when I can, I solder and heat shrink. I use my clothes pin setup to hold the wires while I solder.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on October 15, 2015, 06:23:02 PM
I also got rid of the wire that was holding on the exhaust. Finally, an MPG update. The last 2 tanks have been over 26 MPG. I am happy ;D My goal was 25+ and a total of $3500 for the rig. I will be just under that once I have the kingpins redone.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: Junk-Yard-John (03-SWB Vitara) on October 16, 2015, 04:06:04 PM
good work with the aluminum ;D
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on June 30, 2016, 10:01:58 PM
It has been quite a while since I updated this. I did redo the front axle, and have mostly been driving it ;D
The latest is that I swapped in a GM CS 130 alternator using an Adventure Offroad kit, and I installed a TOY250 carb. The carb is great at low speeds, but I need to figure out why it runs out of fuel at highway speeds. I called National Carburetors and they said the float needed adjusted. I will tinker with it some more this weekend. Also, while I was tearing it apart, I redid the battery tray area. I used a spare tray from one of my Dodge parts trucks and modified it to fit. I also patched some acid holes. Here's some pics.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on June 30, 2016, 10:05:53 PM
For the carb swap, I chose to use my rotary tool to shave down the cable end. I built a cable bracket out of an old bed frame, and then on the pedal end, I put in a longer stop bolt and bent the pedal so it had the same throw to the floor as original. I popped off the little bracket on the air cleaner, and that alone made it clear the carb, however, I still chose to install the Legrande doughnut I saw others use.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on June 30, 2016, 10:09:34 PM
I have to say, at the lower speeds, this carb is impressive. MUCH better take off torque, and it was a relatively easy carb to install. I just need to fix the highway speed stumple/starvation issue, and I will be really happy.
I might also make my own EGR blockoff plate this weekend. We'll see...
Question: what do you guys do with the unused sensor plugs? Cut them off, or just tape them up?
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: Tan Zuk on July 01, 2016, 09:16:51 PM
Thats to bad about the highway speed. Been running mine now for over 6 years with only a couple of mixture screw adjustments when 1st installed. I have helped many people with this swap and you are the 1st with that issue.

I would make the EGR block off plate. I also plugged all the brass vacuum fittings. The rubber plugs tend to deteriorate rather quickly and can cause all kinds of issues. I also got rid of all the excess sensors devises that were no longer being used.

Just thinking out loud about your high speed issue. I bought a new fuel pump when I did the swap. I also changed the fuel filter back by the tank. Your vacuum canister may also be in bad shape. Have seen mud dobbers build nests in the canister. If you get deep into mud or water this stuff can clog the bottom vent on the canister.

Here is a pic of my Toy250 carb with plugged vacuum and EGR port.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 02, 2016, 07:49:14 AM
Yeah, you pop up a bunch if you do a "toy250 swap" internet search. I read the ACKs writeup, but when I went to do it, the website no longer works :( Anyway, I tore it apart last night, and found the float is barely rising before shutting off the fuel. I hate to bash the place I got it from, but the idle mixture was out a bunch (6 turns?) and that should have been an indicator. Anyway, I looked it over and did some tweaks. I couldn't find how high to set the float for this carb, so I shot for 7.75mm. I found two different Toy carb tutorials who had two different settings, and 7.75 was in the middle.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 02, 2016, 07:52:51 AM
Since I was on a roll, I then decided to work on my EGR block off plate. I used a chunk of 3/16" and traced the gasket, and since I was making such great progress, I decided to paint it and the intake last night as well.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 02, 2016, 07:57:44 AM
Just thinking out loud about your high speed issue. I bought a new fuel pump when I did the swap. I also changed the fuel filter back by the tank. Your vacuum canister may also be in bad shape. Have seen mud dobbers build nests in the canister. If you get deep into mud or water this stuff can clog the bottom vent on the canister.
I just re-read this. I don't think those are any of the causes because, while it wasn't perfect, I just tore off the factory carb and it didn't have this issue. I find it hard to believe either of those issues cause it, especially given where the float was :o
How did you remove your sensor wiring? Cut, or just wrap it up?
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: Tan Zuk on July 02, 2016, 12:09:08 PM
I have only heard of 2 people having some issues with the National Carbs Toy250 carbs. One of my metering screws was bend alittle, I was concerned at 1st but has never caused a problem.

I generally don't cut wires back. I strip the tape back from the harness in the area where the wires you want to conseal are located. Weave the extra wiring back into the haness and then tape to blend in with the existing harness.

Here is that Acks NEW link
http://acksfaq.com/2016bp.php?urlname=http://www.acksfaq.com/HTML/toycarbinstall.htm (http://acksfaq.com/2016bp.php?urlname=http://www.acksfaq.com/HTML/toycarbinstall.htm)

Here is a thread with a bunch of good info and links
http://bbs.zuwharrie.com/content?PHPSESSID=c677ed1f3a8d115d502070c8d662d94b&topic=123850.msg1227190#new (http://bbs.zuwharrie.com/content?PHPSESSID=c677ed1f3a8d115d502070c8d662d94b&topic=123850.msg1227190#new)

Hopefully resetting the float solves the problem.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 02, 2016, 07:05:41 PM
Thanks for the new link. Today, I took the top off and fiddled with the float. I had 2 problems. 1) the float was still a little off, but the big one was 2) the tab on the float was improper, and the plunger fell out of the needle and immediately flooded my engine. I mean big time. Fuel running all down the outside of the carb. I spent a few minutes aligning the tab so it doesn't pop off all through the range of motion and adjusted the float to about 7.8mm.

I took it for a ride and drove it a little harder than I normally do. No problems. I think I fixed it, but a few more miles to ensure will be the proof. The only thing I can't seem to get exactly right is my warm idle. Right now it is about 1100-1200 RPM.
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: Tan Zuk on July 02, 2016, 08:57:46 PM
No problem glad to help.

Wow! You are lucky it didn't burn to the ground, hope you changed your oil after that. Sounds like you got it figured out. I've had band new Holley and Edelbrock carbs, have the floats hang open out of the box. This can be a big problem with a high volume electric pump. Got into the practice of having a rubber mallet on hand for such occasions.

Guess National Carb may be having some quality control issues. They probably didn't sell to many of these Toy250 carbs before the swap started for the Zuks, maybe they are having troubles sourcing parts. Seem to remember someone mentioned they were out of carbs about a year ago, he waited until they got more in before doing the swap.

One guy said when he got his, the extra parts that normally get stripped off were already removed. They are still better then the nightmare Ebay carbs that never seem to work. I always tell people not to get them from a junk yard or Ebay.

Unfortunately Zuk owners seem very frugal and stubborn and not heed my warning. Then I get a PM and they cant get the carb to work. Just got a PM about 2 weeks ago wianting help with a junk yard carb. I honestly have not had to do anything to mine, except follow the swap instructions and it worked out of the box. Oh, other then getting rid of all the pesky vacuum plugs helped alot.

As for as the idle, I seem to remember mine did a fluctuation from 1000 to 1500 for awhile. It finally stopped on its own at 1000 rpms, seems to be where my carb is happy at. If you are trying to get it to factory idle, probably not going to happen.

Nice chatting with you
Terry
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on July 03, 2016, 06:04:00 PM
The carb I got was stripped. There's nothing on it. I like it :laugh:

I am not new to tinkering with cars, but am new to the samurais, and I appreciate you have made yourself available to the online community to help with the Sami quirks. Thanks again ;)
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: crusty on January 26, 2018, 04:04:32 PM
Update time. I sold it :P While I loved my sami, and drove it daily, we decided to move back to Idaho. That being said, I am thinking about a 2 door tracker/sidekick. The refinements are appealing, as well as the fact that they are more available.

There's something addicting about a tiny vehicle. They sure are fun!
Title: Re: Snail's Pace 87 Build
Post by: ebewley on January 28, 2018, 02:58:43 PM
Oh man... That's like a cliff hanger with some sort of Episode 1 Jar Jar binks thrown in...

Sidekicks are cool good luck with your search.

-Eric