ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Technical Discussion - Performance / Modify => Topic started by: 96kicker4 on March 30, 2010, 07:49:57 AM
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i have a 1996 sidekick sport with the 1.8.plenty of power in town but just took it on a road trip from portland to sacramento and it could use some more power for the mountain passes. what mods do these motors respond well to? it is completely stock now and 33s are in its future, as well as a gear swap.
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Well, gears for sure will help, but the only real power adders would be different for the 1.8 compared to the 1.6. There doesn't seem to be much in the way of performance stuff geared to the 1.8. You could try the standard stuff, K+N air filter, a good header and muffler, maybe a larger exhaust system ( 2/ or 2/14" tubing) Those thing usually benefit any engine and seem to bring the 16v to life.
Then there's always turbocharging.
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ya i have a turbo from a subaru loyal 1.8 laying around. hmmm.
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Just put a 2.0 from a newer Vitara or Tracker in it... You'll be amazed at the difference it makes. It's like putting a V6 in it... Almost... I did that to the last Sport I had with a manual and had 32" tires under it... The engine didn't even notice the bigger tires going down the freeway. I could easily do 95 in it with the A/C on, till I had to slow down for traffic that is...
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Drop in a 2.7. At 95 I'm still pressed back against the seat....
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a new full exhaust with a good header, high flow cat, and muffler, different cam(s) port and polish, each are good. I wouldnt touch k&crap filters with a 50 foot pole personally. you have to sacrifice filtration to gain flow, its just simple physics.
beyond this, turbocharging is the next logical step, but generally you want forged rods and pistons to hold up to the power sufficiently.
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a new full exhaust with a good header, high flow cat, and muffler, different cam(s) port and polish, each are good. I wouldnt touch k&crap filters with a 50 foot pole personally. you have to sacrifice filtration to gain flow, its just simple physics.
beyond this, turbocharging is the next logical step, but generally you want forged rods and pistons to hold up to the power sufficiently.
This.
Just make sure you do a compression test to make sure its worth the head work. I got my head all done and my rings are shot. 90, 92, 75, 107 for the numbers. Dropped in some oil and it bumped up to 125+ across all of them.
When I fix the ring issues it should be real nice power improvement and I have a turbo off a Saab to go on it.
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a new full exhaust with a good header, high flow cat, and muffler, different cam(s) port and polish, each are good. I wouldnt touch k&crap filters with a 50 foot pole personally. you have to sacrifice filtration to gain flow, its just simple physics.
beyond this, turbocharging is the next logical step, but generally you want forged rods and pistons to hold up to the power sufficiently.
Are you actually saying this from your previous experience in scientific testing or just some crap you heard on the net? I've been using K+N Air filters for several huindred thousand miles on two of my 4 wheel vehicles and on my Custom 1988 FLH harley for 70,000 miles. I've done top end tear down and inspection on the Harley and it looks brand new inside, and no visable or MEASURABLE wear on the cylinders. Seems they work just fine in the Turbo Tracker too.
I'm also TURBOCHARGED on the STOCK rods and pistons, liquid to air intercooled, and have been for over 30,000 miles without a problem. Keep the boost below 6lbs and your golden. Just ask anyone who's riddin in mine, it's plenty quick and RELIABLE.
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who makes a header for the s1.8? thinking abou the 2.0. my motor all of a sudden went through 5 quarts of oil on a recent road trip. did this over about 5 hours, no leaks. kinda baffled. pcv valve was bad but so far thats all i have found and it has not used oil since. definately adding oil presure gadge, hate the stupid lights.
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a new full exhaust with a good header, high flow cat, and muffler, different cam(s) port and polish, each are good. I wouldnt touch k&crap filters with a 50 foot pole personally. you have to sacrifice filtration to gain flow, its just simple physics.
beyond this, turbocharging is the next logical step, but generally you want forged rods and pistons to hold up to the power sufficiently.
Are you actually saying this from your previous experience in scientific testing or just some crap you heard on the net? I've been using K+N Air filters for several huindred thousand miles on two of my 4 wheel vehicles and on my Custom 1988 FLH harley for 70,000 miles. I've done top end tear down and inspection on the Harley and it looks brand new inside, and no visable or MEASURABLE wear on the cylinders. Seems they work just fine in the Turbo Tracker too.
I'm also TURBOCHARGED on the STOCK rods and pistons, liquid to air intercooled, and have been for over 30,000 miles without a problem. Keep the boost below 6lbs and your golden. Just ask anyone who's riddin in mine, it's plenty quick and RELIABLE.
on the turbocharging, I figue a number closer to 10+ pounds of boost, and k&N is prettywell proven in the moto world to be crap. I'll run BMC over thse things.
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Again Bob, Proven By Whom?
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I've run K&N's on motorcycles, snowmobiles, cars and trucks all with no problems. When they first came out for bikes there was testing done that showed an oiled filter trapped dirt as well as paper and when it got dirty it filtered better. I've also used foam based filters and they don't flow like a K&N.
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Again Bob, Proven By Whom?
I'm going to have to agree on the side of K&N being a good product. Please send us links to independent tests/studies defending your argument. Saying that you can't have enough filtration without restriction is like saying that the only way to increase power is to increase displacement. K&N's flow better with the same filtration because its not a glorified paper coffee filter or glorified kitchen sponge (foam) but a nice tight knit cotton allowing free flowing tubes that would let dirt pass through if not for the oil for collection. The only bad thing I've ever heard resulting from K&N filters is over oiling gunking up a MAF sensor.
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K&N filters are rubbish at filtering dust and very fine particles. They are better when they are dirty but the flow rate drops off dramatically. For outright flow then clean and oiled they are probably the best filter. I did dyno tests on a number of filters a few years ago but that was for a racing bike so max. filtration wasn't an issue I just wanted to keep out the worst stuff.
Theres an independant test here and I'm sure there will be a few more if you search:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/airfilter/airtest3.htm (http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/airfilter/airtest3.htm)
Tight knit? try holding one up to a light.
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Rhinoman I've always respected your opinions and knowledge, and would tend to agree with you on this except for one thing: you seem to contradict yourself when stating " they are rubbish at filtering dust and fine particles" then later in the same sentence you state:" for outright flow, then clean and oiled they are probably the best filter." I use K+N filters particularly because they are CLEANABLE, easily actually, and easy to re oil. Now I may agree that ultra fine dust may get by , but if its that fine it's not going to do any real damage to the motor, especially if you observe regular oil changes with good oil. I've also done dyno comparisons between K+N, Harley's own performance brand Screaming eagle, and stock filters, and the K+N out performs all, properly clean and oiled. Who would put one in not properly cleaned and oiled? I probably wouldn't use one on a pure dirt ( motocross/enduro) bike, only because it would require more maintenance. The oiled foam filters are better at keeping out water from the airbox too, but clog up real fast. I had a Calmini oiled foam filter, and found a noticeable increase in throttle response when I switched to K+N. Besides, Calmini has no real instructions on cleaning and oiling there filters, and when I asked the sales rep he said NO oil. Might as well stuff the airbox with a rag.
PS, on my old road race bikes we used velocity stacks, air filter? what air filter! Of course today's bikes have sophisticated air boxes and really good breathing systems so an air filter really doesn't hurt flow too much. OH, and did you buy anything from "BOB"?
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we have used K|removethispart|@N on our dirt track cars for years. eating dust at 8500 rpm. running at about 210-230 degrees all night long. no prob. I think that proves how good they are. clean them take care of them they are awesome.
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Rhinoman I've always respected your opinions and knowledge, and would tend to agree with you on this except for one thing: you seem to contradict yourself when stating " they are rubbish at filtering dust and fine particles" then later in the same sentence you state:" for outright flow, then clean and oiled they are probably the best filter."
I only just saw this reply.
I probably should have said "clean and oiled they are probably the best performance filter". The dyno tests I did comparing cone filters showed that an oiled K&N gave the best flow/bhp, with a big enough filter I got no loss of power over an open intake, K&N claim that the filtering gets better the dirtier it gets which I'm sure is true but as it gets dirty the flow drops off and you lose power. Some of the other filters clearly had a more open gauze/element which would give worse filtering but also flowed less, this seems to be down to the K&N having more of a "bellmouth" shape to the moulding where the air enters the carb.
On my road bike running a K&N element in the stock airbox I was seeing dust/dirt in the airbox which never happened with the stock filter, this was the same gauze used on the cone filters. I had to clean it at roughly the same interval as I would have replaced the stock because the performance tailed off noticably.
I used to run bikes on open intakes but you can get a lot of muck in the engine, particularly when its wet and there is a lot of spray. I put the filter on the racer after dirt in the carb caused the slide to jam open, very nearly causing a big high speed off. On susbsequent engine rebuilds I didn't see the same scoring on the bores that I used to get running open.
Like a lot of tuning its a compromise between engine longevity and power.
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I've run K&N's on motorcycles, snowmobiles, cars and trucks all with no problems. When they first came out for bikes there was testing done that showed an oiled filter trapped dirt as well as paper and when it got dirty it filtered better. I've also used foam based filters and they don't flow like a K&N.
I have meen riding the sand dunes since the early 1980's here in Oregon and we have always ran K&N filters with great success. I run them on my cars too. I went deer hunting over in Eastern Oregon for 8 days and racked up 4-500 hundred miles and when i got back I pulled it off to clean it and the intake boot and maf was spotless.
Bentparts,
have you ran thru the quarter with the turbo? I'm one of those jonesers that runs everything I own!
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The subject of filters comes up from time to time. Here is one such topic to have a read of http://forum.outerlimits4x4.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=177704&hilit=filter (http://forum.outerlimits4x4.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=177704&hilit=filter) which is one of many discussions.
ISUZUROVER has done filtration R&D for a number of years but believe what you want.
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And some more
http://forum.outerlimits4x4.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=52557&p=605530&hilit=formula#p605530 (http://forum.outerlimits4x4.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=52557&p=605530&hilit=formula#p605530)
http://forum.outerlimits4x4.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=45726 (http://forum.outerlimits4x4.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=45726)
http://forum.outerlimits4x4.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=45580 (http://forum.outerlimits4x4.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=45580)
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Hi
I have seen comments regarding purchasing headers and cams for the Sport 1.8L here... Would someone be so kind as to point me in the right direction to where I can find/purchase such items? I have searched the internet for over a year (I do feel competent at internet searching) and have never found any one with these products for the Sport 1.8L.
I know that most competent exhaust shops should be able to fabricate a custom exhaust from the exhaust manifold and back, but logic dictates to free up the restriction closest to the head where the heat is most extreme, meaning the exh. manifold/header.
Personally I have contemplated having the head, intake and exhaust manifold Extrude Honed for increased performance. Has anyone tried this and if so how has it come out in regards to power increase and milage?
At the moment I am also planing a 2.0L swap into my 1.8L Sport. I have a new/used engine and plan on doing a .20 over bore and total rebuild before the 2.0L goes in. Any info on the swap if some one has done this is appreciated.