ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Technical Discussion - Performance / Modify => Topic started by: joshembry on January 01, 2010, 10:32:52 PM
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Sorry if this is already posted somewhere....but i didnt see it
Just trying to get everyones opinion on the best engine swap for a samurai
Rocky road sells a bunch of conversion kits ranging from turning your 1.3 into a 1.6 or a 1.9 VW turbo diesel or a Vortec V6
just curious as too peoples experience with these different motors and which are best for the money. Thanks for your help
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I smell a poll coming on! :)
This is a tough one because the use of the vehicle plays a significant role in what engine may be best. Let's assume overall driving enjoyment, performance, and reliability as the key points.
-Eric
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Don't forget ease of installation.
I'm a big fan of the 1.6L installs so you can put in a Kicker 3 or Shogun setup and get a two speed transfer case.
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I have been (passenger and/or driver) in :
4.3L V-6 Sami
305 V-8 sami (really does not count due to front suspension being way overloaded and we could not get it out of the parking lot
1.3L Zuk
1.6L Zuk
The most impressive performance I experienced was in a near stock 1.6L (Zuk) Sami. BUT, I did see group of guys at a ZukiMelt one year running RX-7 rotary motors in their Sami's :o WOW those things were fast in the sand. Never saw them on the trails though.
Zig
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I have been (passenger and/or driver) in :
4.3L V-6 Sami
305 V-8 sami (really does not count due to front suspension being way overloaded and we could not get it out of the parking lot
1.3L Zuk
1.6L Zuk
The most impressive performance I experienced was in a near stock 1.6L (Zuk) Sami. BUT, I did see group of guys at a ZukiMelt one year running RX-7 rotary motors in their Sami's :o WOW those things were fast in the sand. Never saw them on the trails though.
Zig
Oh yeah, rotary... I forgot... I'll add that and a couple others that are sort of common that I just thought of.
-Eric
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It depends on what you terrain you wheel on as to how much power you need (or want). Ease of installation can argueably be the 1.6/1.8 motors, or the 2.0/2.5/2.7 motors. The 4.3 Chevy is a powerhouse and does fit nicely, but I have heard complaints from people that they are super heavy or that they are a pain to put in (not mention expensive). The diesel swaps are also desirable for the down low power and are not too hard to put in. The downside is that they can be very expensive to collect all the parts and install. The rotory motors makes gobs of power and great for mud/sand racing, but take more fabrications skills to install as there really isn't any conversion kits made for them.......yet. I guess it's all up to the individual driver as to what their needs are.
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I would vote 1.6 8V for easiest installation, 1.6 16V for best all round motor. As I only get one vote I'll go 16V for best combination of weight/power and ease of installation.
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Diesel all the way. Better fuel economy, and you can make your own fuel from french fry grease.
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I'd say the 2.0 for the big jump in power with only a little jump in weight.
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Can't tell you for the Sammy but I've driven a '95 Tracker 2 door with a 2.7 for about 30,000 street miles and the power is far more fun than I could imagine with a 4 banger. Swap is fairly straightforward; I don't notice any evil characteristics from the added weight compared to a stock 1.6L 16v as I imagine you would with the 4.3. A 4.3 is about 195 hp compared to the 2.7's 183 hp. Considering power to weight I would imagine the 2.7 would be faster but I've never made an actual comparison.
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Can't tell you for the Sammy but I've driven a '95 Tracker 2 door with a 2.7 for about 30,000 street miles and the power is far more fun than I could imagine with a 4 banger. Swap is fairly straightforward; I don't notice any evil characteristics from the added weight compared to a stock 1.6L 16v as I imagine you would with the 4.3. A 4.3 is about 195 hp compared to the 2.7's 183 hp. Considering power to weight I would imagine the 2.7 would be faster but I've never made an actual comparison.
Except for your post----The input was for a Sammy----Is there a thread that shows the same poll for the Trackers with 2dr/4wd.
Happy
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I'd say the 2.0 for the big jump in power with only a little jump in weight.
X2. Thats what I voted for, and am planning on. I'm also a fan of the dohc 1.3 out of the swift gti. I want one for the white zuk.
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i saw somewhere a samurai sporting a LS 2 corvette engine, id get in too much trouble :police:
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Hi everyone, I am new to the site. I have an 86' sammy with a 7" lift, 6.5:1 gears, 31x10.5 tire on 15" wheels and I am now looking into an engine swap. Like everyone else I am troubled as to what to install, although after much deliberation and searching I am very seriously considering the 1.6 16V. Because I believe the 4.3 is too heavy. The 1.6 will also except mt stock sammy tranny, which I like. If anyone can give me feed back on that I would appreciate it. The 1.6 has 120hp stock and there are many performance upgrades that can be done to give more HP and torque.
Zukirat
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ill be right at about that same height, do you have a pic of your rig?
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I like my 1,6 8v, enough power to runt 35s on the street and it is a super easy swap.
I have a friend who runs a vw 1,6 td with some extra turbo boost, that thing has so much power!
I know some people with volvo 2,3 litres to, plenty of power, but seem a bit to nose heavy to me.
Personally I feel that the light weight of the samurai is one of its biggest advantages, I would never put a heavy engine in one of these.
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i am starting a motor swap on my 89 jx sidekick here real soon.it has a blown 1.6 in it ... well in the back of it...lol.and i have a 2.3 ford turbo motor...out of an 86 svo mustang...anybody ever do a 2.3 ford swap on one?
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I like my 1,6 8v, enough power to runt 35s on the street and it is a super easy swap.
I have a friend who runs a vw 1,6 td with some extra turbo boost, that thing has so much power!
I know some people with volvo 2,3 litres to, plenty of power, but seem a bit to nose heavy to me.
Personally I feel that the light weight of the samurai is one of its biggest advantages, I would never put a heavy engine in one of these.
I too experienced 1.6 td. The turbos provide awesome raw power at low rpms as well. Its best suited for Samurai.
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Diesel all the way. Better fuel economy, and you can make your own fuel from french fry grease.
Lol I work in an asian restaurant and they told me they'd give me all the soybean oil I want...now to figure how to make that into fuel... ::)
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Diesel all the way. Better fuel economy, and you can make your own fuel from french fry grease.
Lol I work in an asian restaurant and they told me they'd give me all the soybean oil I want...now to figure how to make that into fuel... ::)
Doesn't sound like a bad deal as long as you have the time and effort to make your own fuel.
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sorry but i am pretty sure the toyote 22r/re is 2.4l not 2.2 i figured that is what you were talking about, the 20r is a 2.2l carbeurated from earlier yotas.
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Diesel all the way. Better fuel economy, and you can make your own fuel from french fry grease.
Lol I work in an asian restaurant and they told me they'd give me all the soybean oil I want...now to figure how to make that into fuel... ::)
fwiw soybean oil makes great bio-diesel and the best stuff comes from Asian restaurants! or you can run it straight with a wvo kit!
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I see no option for the GSXR 1300 Hyabusa.... or the Suzuki 3.6l TT monster hillclimb special..... actually the one i want to see most to stay in true suzuki fashion would be this...
http://www.h1v8.com/page/page/1562069.htm (http://www.h1v8.com/page/page/1562069.htm)
400hp
245ft/lbs of torque
all in a 200lb engine ;D... mmmmhhmmm I want one in my geo... doesnt quite fit in my budget... or my mortgage
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New guy here. Gotta put my vote in for the 16V 1.6. I, too, am seriously considering busting open my piggy bank to get started on this swap. My poor ol 1.3 still runs good, but it's just not cut out for the other mods it's having to haul around.
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factory ponnies. 16 valve 1.6 L
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<Zuk only rant>
Hi my name is James and I've been doing the Suzuki thing for quite a while, my first one would be 'to die for' now, I bought it new: 1984 LWB SJ410, beautiful dark metallic green paint and the 1.0l 4cyl, 48 hp motor! (235s added) I took it all over N.A. and had many, many inquiries about it. Even took it to Pismo, quite a story, maybe another time... ;)
I still have and love my midnight black '92 Samurai that I bought new in '91, I put 50k km on it for the next 4/5 years. When the rocker shaft screws punched a hole in my head in '96 I decided to up-size to a 1.6 16v from a Swift sedan that also had TBI. Near the end of the splicing/integration of the wiring for the new manifold/ECM I decided it was a bad idea because of the different fuel pressure requirements and ECM/relay/VSS issues etc, youthful enthusiasm got the best of me. Most of my Zuk buddies were running 1.3GT motors at the time in invisible check engine mode: with fuel economy and overheating/lean issues for all, they still made a ton 'o HP though with just a good exhaust & intake. Last time I checked long 4cyl like motors like Toyotas don't fit very well because of lack of acc. pulley/radiator room, I personally would never just rely on an external aftermarket elec. fan for cooling.
The 1.6 8v I swapped in allows the existing intake and exhaust to be used, the motor is 30mm taller and I have no hood clearance issues. I did change the tbi body with a 1.6 version because of the larger throat bore, just had to T one vacuum line. There are two Sami ecms that have significantly different max. parameters for fuel, mines a Mitsubishi if that helps, sorry, I can't remember the specifics right now. I've been driving with this set-up for 15 years now, the motor has about 200k km on it and it still runs as strong, cool and super efficient as ever. A really good cam, intake, ignition and exhaust really makes the boring 8v come to life and returns great mpg and is super reliable too. My vote is obvious.
I also recently sold my black 2001 2.0l auto 2dr Vitara to a buddy because of the mediocre fuel economy amongst other things, he's very happy and so am I. :laugh: I just bought a perfect, 1 owner, black 93 JA Sidekick tintop (1.6 8v) with 33k km! on it for a stupidly low ($2700cdn) amount of cash, we were both happy with the deal but I couldn't stop grinning for at least a day. She'll be all Suzuki just like my other Zuk, I could post a build-up thread here as well but it may be kinda boring for some. :laugh:
~J
<end Zuk only rant>
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in this location was once a stupid question. I have since then answered my own.
GEO 1.8 GSI motor = 120hp and is also based on an isuzu 4ZD1 block
Thanks.
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My vote is for the 1.6 8V with a CV carb. This is what I have on my DD TT and the low end power is fantastic! I purchased the 100K mile engine for $350, made my own adaptor, used HD CV carb for $50, two 6 packs for my friend to weld up the intake, all new hoses $60, one Dodge motor mount $5, used 1.6 exhaust manifold $40, 2" flex for the exhaust $20, misc nuts & bolts. I have ALL the parts to install a 16V but after driving this for 3 years and 100K+ more miles, I see no gain for what I have invested in the 8V. I may sell the 16V or put it in another TT if I can find one cheap enough. I have invested more in the 16V conversion parts than I have invested in my TT including the purchase price. For me this was my best bang for the buck.
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Just wanted to give you a shout from the valley of the sun, great information. Much appreciated.
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well, we swapped something new, a 2.2 diesel r2 mazda.
tons of body work, but now running fine even on stock diffs and axles.
just take care of the 1st gear though. very low-range gearing.
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I drive a '97 Suzuki Samurai SJ80 with a 1.3 carbureter engine and 28" tyres. It's got enough power for offroading, very nippy in city traffic and reach 120kph on a flat road (even 140kph downhill), but uphill it falls down to 80 and even 70kph!!
Will the 1.6 8v carbureter engine be able to maintain 120kph uphill? What's the top speed of a Samurai fitted with this engine?
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I drive a '97 Suzuki Samurai SJ80 with a 1.3 carbureter engine and 28" tyres. It's got enough power for offroading, very nippy in city traffic and reach 120kph on a flat road (even 140kph downhill), but uphill it falls down to 80 and even 70kph!!
Will the 1.6 8v carbureter engine be able to maintain 120kph uphill? What's the top speed of a Samurai fitted with this engine?
The 1.6L engine 8-vavle is rated at 85hp, the 1.6l 16v multi-port fuel injection at 95hp.
We don't have the SJ80 over there, but they came with both the 1.3l and 1.0l engine. In most markets the SJ80 had a 1.3L engine in 97, but I can't find if it's Fuel injected or not. The 1.0l carb was rated at 45hp stock, the 1.3l carb at 65hp. But if you have the 1.3l multi-port fuel injection motor that they have on the Gypsy then your rated at 75hp stock, so won't see that large of a jump going up to the 1.6l 8 vavle.
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The US version of the 8V engine was rated at 80 HP, but there is a
significant difference in torque, the 1.6L engine is a 1mm over bore
but 15mm stroked 1.3 engine, and this stroke increase really adds
to the "power" you get, torque is the power, not the HP, but they
are linked. In a Diesel engine the torque is roughly double the HP
figure, where on the gasoline engines, it is roughly the same as HP
figures, so a 80 HP diesel has a much greater power factor than it's
80 HP gas counterpart
Wild
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If the 1.6 ever takes a dump in my zuk my engine combo will be a nissan 240sx ka engine with a nissan 720 4x4 trans plenty of hp fuel injection (which i know very well) and the early 4x4 trannys were a divorced unit and will bolt up directly to a nissan ka series engine. or the diesel is interesting too but im not a huge fan of sludge burners.
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I was wondering where would be the best place to find a Swift DOHC 1.3 , or did they also make a 1.8 ? Seems the best fit for my 87 Samurai ? Any thoughts or coments ? I am new to this generation as my last Suzuki was a 2 cycle ? , and that was in the 70s....gives you some idea of my age.......Just needed for ATV two track trails due to the width of 60 inches., and Its fun to dribe. I will be using 31s and I guess lower gears. Its a stone stock tin top. I almost hate to touch it.
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Hi.
Kinda new to this site.
Owner -Resurrection Iron Works.
I recently started a Samurai build and have been contemplating the very thing we are now discussing.
After researching all of these swaps listed and a few more that were overlooked. I have decided to go with a Datsun L-18
With a Datsun dog leg 5 speed.
The L-18 produces 105 hp (stock) carbureted. This engine is known for its power, it's ability to spool , and it's reliability.
While the L-18s are becoming scarce the L-16 Datsun motor at 96hp (carburetor) is prevalent and cheap.
Dimensional they are very similar to the above mentioned 4 bangers but produce better power without the need of computers and expensive and troublesome EFI units.
I grew up racing Datsun 510s and Z cars . I may have a bit of a love affair with these engines.. But it is well deserved...
The engine pictured is a duel curbed SSS 1800 ( L-18T) 110hp on regular gas. 102 fb of torque. and will run at 8000 rpm all day.
Its mated to a drop pan Datsun 4 speed (Bullet proof tranny)
We installed it into a 1966 MGB With amazing results......
With an Iron block and an aluminum head it going to be slightly heavier than the 1.3 , but not enough to make a significant difference.
(http://i1109.photobucket.com/albums/h423/Boxcar2/mgbsssl-16003.jpg)
(http://i1109.photobucket.com/albums/h423/Boxcar2/mgbsssl-16013.jpg)
Once we get the new engine prepared for the install I will start a build thread on this site......Boxcar...
I gues I should mention...The engine for the Samurai will not be running duel carbs . It will be preped with a holly 2bbl.
on a Bob Sharp Manifold. L-20b stock cam - Mallorym electromic ignition......etc..
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I'd say the 2.0 for the big jump in power with only a little jump in weight.
X2. Thats what I voted for, and am planning on. I'm also a fan of the dohc 1.3 out of the swift gti. I want one for the white zuk.
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Ive been in samis with v8s and ive had one with a 4.3 the swap was a pain. the sami i have now ive swapped in a fuel injected cammed 2.3l ford and auto tranny I love the power and if you have a good donor vehicle the swap isnt too bad. I can actually pass 18 wheelers now >:D
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Has anybody thought about sawping in a honda k motor or heard of anybody that has done it? I know u can bolt a honda s 2000 6sp trans to it. I don't know the deminsions but I do know you can make 300hp at the rear tires with a cam swap and re flash of the computer. :-
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What about the Suzuki 2.3 (155hp) from the Suzuki Areo? It's a bolt-in, but it's not mentioned in your survey.
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What about the Suzuki 2.3 (155hp) from the Suzuki Areo? It's a bolt-in, but it's not mentioned in your survey.
It's on there now... I wouldn't call it 'bolt in' but neither are a lot of the other engine choices.
-Eric
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Has anybody thought about sawping in a honda k motor or heard of anybody that has done it? I know u can bolt a honda s 2000 6sp trans to it. I don't know the deminsions but I do know you can make 300hp at the rear tires with a cam swap and re flash of the computer. :-
Most Honda engines rotate in th opposite direction , that may be rectified through the longitudinal (rwd) transmission idk just. Heads up to those considering Honda engines
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Guess I'll be the "odd ball" on this thread.Had a '88.5 Samurai and the stock engine started knockin,so I intstalled a Buick V6 3.8 ltr,carburated.Then went with a 200m GM auto tranny,only a 3 spd automatic.Worked out good but I never could get it enouph cooling with the stock cooling setup.I would drive it all around but when I got to my destination no matter 15 min or a hour it would be -hot- and would geyser!!Had to fab the motor mounts and tranny mount and had to move the t-case back about 10 inches,this REALLY shortened that rear driveshaft!!Also ment that my intermediate shaft was basically a solid piece that slipped into the yoke at the front of the tranny,with only a u-joint on the engine side.
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the samurai that i had i put a 2.4 l z24 engine out of an old nissan 720 pickup. with nitrous and quite a bit of engine work it worked awesome
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Old thread. Wish I had read it before we put a 91 caddie 4.9 and GM 4L30 trans in our 86 sammie. Way more work than we thought it would be. It's a tight fit but fun little sleeper.
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Do you have pictures of your cadillac motor? I'd like to see that.
People still vote on this thread; there's enough votes for some good trending.
-Eric
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test. Still working the last bugs out on the 4.9, V8, 700R4 Sasquatch.
(https://i.imgur.com/Eq3gOrD.jpg)
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(https://i.imgur.com/PYgvg57.jpg)
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My little brother at the wheel. We think we have almost all the bugs out after over 4 years.
(https://i.imgur.com/DNaedHU.jpg)
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Early on without the power steering.
(https://i.imgur.com/iUFPPXm.jpg).
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We replaced the 4L30 with a 700R4, the first and last time we will EVER completely rebuild an auto trans. RJ didn't like the 4l30 and it ran hotter than we liked. We scratch built the headers to the quietest exhaust we could get while keeping the emissions junk. Custom mated the 700 to the 4L30's transfer case. Narrow jeep axles front and rear with 4.56 gears. Home built 27 gal gas tank. We did a cross member under the engine to mount to. And the 91 caddie 4.9. Front and rear links are in the future. It has kept RJ out of trouble and the bars.
PS It had the best house paint money could buy on it when we got it. We figured just camo it and don't worry.
It pulls up a 6% grade on the highway at 70 plus if you back off early. That's why I don't ride with RJ. I'm older and wiser.
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Is that a tow bar or a PUSH bar?! Looks awesome nice job.
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That's the towbar/stinger.
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QUICK QUESTION WILL A WHOLE ENGINE TRANSMISSION TRANSFER AND BOTH AXLES FROM A JEEP CHEROKEE FIT A SAMURAI???????
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Quick answer...No, buy a Cherokee
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Quick answer...No, buy a Cherokee
:)
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Has anybody seen any flat four Subaru swaps? My 1.3 mounts are only 4mm off in each direction... I'd grab a WRX engine in a heartbeat...
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I wouldn't think the rails are far enough apart to accommodate a boxer...
Mind you, it's all about how much time & money you're willing to throw at it.
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I wouldn't think the rails are far enough apart to accommodate a boxer...
Mind you, it's all about how much time & money you're willing to throw at it.
Yea, I did a little web digging on dimentions, and the suby engine is quite a bit wider than the mounts would indicate... also a taller linkup to the transmission.