ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Suzuki 4x4 Forum => Topic started by: kottunmewth on March 12, 2009, 01:52:14 AM
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I'm going to kick a topic off because there seems to be more modified suzuki vehicles here then on suzuki forums site.I know the Canadians have a lot of modified suzukis up there so want all of ya to chime in.
I'm going to put a solid front axle on my suzuki so the question is do I go with a 4 link toyota conversion or do I go with a leaf spring conversion.4 link will give me the best ride and articulation of the 2 but leaf spring have been around the longest and are considered by many the strongest and the best.The leaf springs are probably the easier of the 2 to do but im not scared of the technical problems,it will make it more challenging and satisfying in the end.
So i'm asking every one that has done these kind of conversions to tell me with they liked better if they have done both or what they would change about the type there currently running?If there was any problems I need to be concerned about by both suspensions or witch one you would prefer and why?Thanks and don't play to hard you'll break something.
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more money, better ride, but more work = 4 link
less money, ok ride, less work = leaf
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zukizuki07 just about covered it. :)
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Ive got a tracker with a solid (samurai)axle & leaves ... it was a pretty simple swap drives as good as a tracker on 35"boggerscan be expected to & is still flexable
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I have the Trail Tough Link set up and it does great. But on the opposite end, my friend is running a wel set up leaf system on his tundra and it also kicks a$$. It's all about doing it right when you do it. He, like me, drives to all events, wheels the hell ou of his ride and drives it home. Do your research and dont cut corners and you'll be satisfied with your result.
We are both on 37's and drive as daily drivers + trail rigs.
Zig
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Hey spitfire, NICE FREAKIN RIG!!!! ;D ;D Seriously, DAMN!
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I have an 05 GV that I'm wanting to get rid of the IFS.All I'm really wanting is a good offroader thats reliable and can be a daily driver on not so smooth roads like louisiana has.Well I guess its a personal preference,The thing I was digging for I guess was,is will the 4 link hold up to hard wheeling.Given the quality of components are good and the welding is good quality.The money and time is no problem.I have seen some 4 link rigs with long control arms and they looked like they would hit and brake before the frame would touch.I'm not looking to build a rock crawler just a good quality rig that I can take down a muddy road hunting or down to the mud pit or drive through the wood in surch of a muddy road,and I won't spend a lot of money on it after I build it to keep it running down the city streets to work.I commute 230 miles one way once a month to work on louisiana roads.
So could some one tell me how there swing arm system worked for them.I'm only looking at putting a maximum of 33" tires on it.and would settle for 31" ,just not with the IFS ive got now. ???
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I dont have a lot of proven miles on the Trailslayer kit like I did on my Calmini IFS set up, but so for it's holding up great to a beating on the trail (including slamming up against rocks, and it still rides great down the interstate with 37's. For what you are looking to do, I think a link or a leaf set up would work fine.
Zig
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Ive got a tracker with a solid (samurai)axle & leaves ... it was a pretty simple swap drives as good as a tracker on 35"boggerscan be expected to & is still flexable
Do you have pics of your set up. i really like the looks of it
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my rig was put together from a rusty totaled car i bought for the 16v mine was done different than I would do a non wrecked car
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4-link is going to ride better, and flex better. Yes, it will hold up. Virtually all "hardcore" offroad rigs are 4-linked. You can also setup the link suspension out further (stretch) for better approach angles where leafs will stick out beyond the tires and hit things. Leaf is going to be easier to setup, but not flex as well. A 3-link (much more common in the front) with a panhard bar will be easy enough to design, and not much more expensive than leafs. If you want an off-the-shelf solution, check out what Trail Tough's got. They might have to custom make you a kit, but I'm sure Brent can let you know...
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I've heard cal mini is making a kit to put the sami axle in the kick but you need to call them. Rick sent me this pic of his rig flexing and thought it was pretty awesome for some samurai springs. Hope he doesn't mind me posting it for him, it needs do be shared.
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I'm looking into doing a 4 link with panhard link.I need to take full measurements before I can plan any further.If 4 link to much trouble ill go with 3 link.I'll make that decision when I'm done with tear down.I'm going to have to modify the cross member any way so when I get to that point I can sit the axle up there and see whats going to line up and whats not.I need to talk to some one about length of the control rods.I'm wanting to make the control rod short and the mount even with the bottom of the frame or attached to the side off the frame to keep the rod connection from hitting the ground when bottoming out.
I've looked at pictures of the trail slayer kit,it looks nice just don't like the bolt on bracket sitting 1"-2" under the vehicle like that.It reduces the ground clearance that you gain from the lift, looks like you would bottom out and bend that all to hell,and bend the control arms.For the flex you get out of it and the lack of options,it does look like the best thing out there.The 4 door would have more trouble with damage to suspension components then 2 doors.If mine was a 2 door I would buy a trailslayer in a minute.Well thanks guys,Its going to be a couple months before I can start buying parts and get every thing together.I need a new welder.
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That is a nice ride there spitfire.........even if it is a wreck ...LOL. Does any body know what the width of a toyota front axle is by any chance.debating on getting an axle custom made or going with a toyota stock.I'm not sure what suzuki put in my GV,I'm at work for a month and can't clime under the vehicle and look rite now. Will I need to change the stock rear axle because of mismatch gearing?I can use wheel spacers for matching the width in back and changing the lug pattern. Again thanks for the help.
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i got a sami in my garage w/toyota axles I could measure where to you want it measured from? I hav a rig I built w/home made 4/5 link it works off road sweet but I built it w/ farmer link ends so its not really for driving on road like you want. if you used good quality rod ends Im sure it could be street driven (safley) but if your interested I could get pics of how I did it
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Yah spitfire, I'd love to see some pics of the 4-5 link.Post the pics here or send to my email.The width I'm looking for is from mounting surface of the tire from one side to the other.That way I have an idea of what kind of spacer I mite need if any for the rear.If its really close in width like say within 1/4 to 1/2 I mite have to change the entire rear axle to get the same bolt pattern.I've been told that toyo wheel have different bolt pattern and I would want them to match.Thinking about doing both any way but it would give me the width I need to plan for wheel spacing for tires.I'm planning on using either 31" or 33" if I can get away with it.But trying to keep the body as stock looking as possible.I'm already planning on moving the flare on the front fender up the fender a little to give me room for 33" if needed to clear,just need to get them to clear the frame. its the back I mite have to do the most work in.I'm hopping that a well planned out axle placement and bump stop will keep me from having to do a lot of chop and cut in the rear and in the front.I'd like to keep the body and suspension as low as possible and still clear the tires to keep center of gravity down low to keep it from wanting to roll over and play dead.Thats why 33 are the biggest tire I'm wanting.Other wise I'd go for 36"s.33 should give me the ideal for on road driving and still perform off road.Trying to get a happy marriage of the 2.Wish me luck.
I'm still making a plan and not going to start working on it till I get the parts on the shop floor,axle and control arms and so forth.I'm big into planning, measure and then plan some more.My dad always told me do it rite the first time and you wont have to do it again.
I see you have a couple car x4's in the yard.The blue one looks like fun,ladder bars ,home made and probably tough as nails.
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first I went to another site for this toyota info......
:Stock Toyota front axle measurements for comparison:
55.5" wide, 29" spring perch centers, '79-85 Toyota trucks and 4runners
63.5" wide, (set up for coil springs) 90-97 FJ80 and FZJ80 Landcruisers
Toyota Rear Axle Widths:
55" wide, '79-85 trucks/4runners
58" wide, '86-95 trucks/4runners
when I did my link set up I looked at several set ups I had some old cj axles, a samurai frame & a spitfire parts car
theres formula to calculate how far apart /long the links should be if ya google
www.4wheeloffroad.com. theres 4 link articles with lots of info
the set up I did really works good flexes excelent tthe only issue was in the beginning I bent the panhard bar& I had to add limiting straps.
the ft is 4links w/a panhard bar the rear is 3 link
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Thanks for the photos rick.The front end lower control arm looks like a 2 piece 4 link set up.Its hard for me to make out in the pics.but it looks simple enough to fab.I don't guess you have any trouble with swaying of the body do you?
See,the only thing that scares me away from the long lower control arms is bottoming out and bending up the control arm on impact of the ground like dropping the tire of into a deep hole.The frame would hit the ground and if the control arms are sitting lower then the frame they will hit with a lot of force,maybe enough to bend and brake stuff.
Have you ever had any trouble with this,cause when I get to moving down a muddy rutted road I'm always hammering on it and I'm not so gentle with it.The best way to get stuck off roading is letting of it when your getting in a bind. A lot of guys will start getting stuck and instead of nailing it and pulling through they will let of the throttle and it'll sink up to there fenders and there they are.Maybe I'm to rough of a driver to do a 4 link.I mite be better of if I stuck with doing a leaf suspension.
Well any way,maybe I'm being overly cautious about it or over analyzing it.thanks for the photos and the time in replying to me.What mite wind up happening is I'll set up the front suspension to match the stock rear susp articulation.I have 4 link with panhard stock in back with coil springs.If the front axle doesn't move up and down perfect and moves front to back a little, I can compensate with a slip yoke 2 piece drive shaft.Well thanks again.
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that car sways some but its stiing on a fullset of tracker springs ft on botom rears on top for the ft no sway bar as for the bending I have not bent any think and have bounced in some rocks been bottomed out going ovr steep hills but I built in the brace that looks like ladder bar and that gives alot of xta strength .if a modified version with better ends, springs was built It would be tough enuff for just about anything if you are really woried there is some stout tube out there
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Thanks again rick for the info and pics.I'm going to start looking for parts and start drawing on some paper.I have the cross member that will have to be modified to allow drive shaft movement when axle moves up & down.I'm thinking about a high pinion toyo for the front to keep u joint binding to a minimum.I'll have some time next weekend off to do some measurements to see how much room I have to work with on tire size and articulation clearance.This going to turn out to be a job of a project but I'll have some thing not seen every day were I live,A GV with SA and 6" of lift.Not a common site in florida.
Thanks to every one for responding, I look at everyones response not just one or two and add them all together.That red 4 door tracker look nice with those boggers on there.Wish I could get them to clear my GV without removing the fenders.I'f they only had them in a 10" wide 33".When I'm done with my GV I'll post some pics if I can figure out how to post them on this forum.I've got to get a new welder,looking at a hobart 250 mig. Thats were my first 2g will go.
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.I'f they only had them in a 10" wide 33".
33/10.50-15LT, TSL Bogger
33/10.50R-15LT, Radial TSL
31/10.50R-15, Radial Trxus Mud Terrain
Your good to go. :D
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Yep,found interco's web site.They have a 33" bogger in a 10.5.Even have it to fit a 16x8 rim to witch is what I have on my stock GV.Thanks drone637,I'll have to do some measuring and see if I have to do a lot of work on the fenders to get them to clear.Had made up my mind to put a set of gateway mudders on it,33.2 x 8.7 - 16 or if I can get a 15 x 6 rim to fit I was going to go with 32.7 x 8.5 - 15.My dad has a sami and was going to test fit a set of his wheels on my rig to see if there was going to be any clearance problems.I'm thinking of going with a custom high pinion 8.8 ford axle up front to keep the angle down on the front drive shaft.It will add a few extra thou to the convertion but I can go bigger in the future plus give me back the 5 x 5.5 bolt pattern to maybe keep my set of stock wheels on it for now to run street tires for non offroad driving and save my very expensive offroad tires for offroading.I don't like running $300 tires around town to look cool when there not needed.It takes maybe 30 min to swap out a set of tires.In stead of a set lasting a year they should last a couple years or more.
Well thanks for the info.