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should i go SAS or not???

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Offline Mike71

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #15 on: May 19, 2004, 06:23:20 AM »
have u thought about SMALLER tires...yes i know u want huge tires..but if u ran like a 31 u could get away with alot more on the stock drivetrain
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Offline explosivo

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #16 on: May 19, 2004, 07:19:49 AM »
I have to agree with Mike here, as when I was looking at SAS'ing my kick, the price of doing that would've been far greater than doing the steel GV housing that I plan on doing.

Just out of curiosity, does anyone know the cost of Heather and Nate's rig? Could give a nice comparison of the cost of SAS and GV front. :-/
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Offline Zukipilot

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #17 on: May 19, 2004, 07:35:15 AM »
I'm lookin at a ford 9" that a club member will GIVE me and with just rough guessing I'm thinking I will have $800-$1000 into it before it goes in to the Kick (REAR not front). So it can get expensive depending on what you want to do. And that is not even considering the time and money to fabricate new control arm mounts, spring mounts, drive shaft (if needed). Who know what I will end up having in it when it's all done :-/ Hopefully my rear shafte will hold up to the extra grab of the MTR's and I wont have to do anything.

Later,
Zig
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Offline 1bigtracker

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #18 on: May 19, 2004, 08:15:59 AM »
well lets look at it this way,  i want to run 36/12.50s on the street.  to a unmodded calmini lift is 900+ after shiping and whatnot.  a steel front end  250 i think.  a locker 200.  and i'll need lower gears for the tires so that 600 more dollors.  sooo...

stock Calmini lift    $900+
steel front end      $250
locker                    $200
gears                    $600

total                     about 2000 bucks  

stu
   

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Offline Mike71

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #19 on: May 19, 2004, 08:29:13 AM »
why do u WANT to run 36" tires?? if u have ur heart set on that large of a tire u pretty much already made up ur mind..SAS! BUT!!!! there are very very capable rigs on 33" tires IFS...just something to think about

sometimes it isnt how big u look sitting..its how big of a smile u have after u have just run
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Offline Mikerpm4x4

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #20 on: May 19, 2004, 08:31:11 AM »
36s on the street huh. I can barely pull my Radial 35s with 5.83 gears. Dont Scout gears only go to 5.12? If so mabey Toyota axles are more up your alley?  :-/ They can run gears as low as 5.71. Thats really not low enough either. Ideally you would want 6.50. However mabey you could go with an OTT setup like heather did and run 5.12s in the scout axles.

Mike
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Offline Mike71

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #21 on: May 19, 2004, 08:40:38 AM »
Quote
well lets look at it this way,  i want to run 36/12.50s on the street.  to a unmodded calmini lift is 900+ after shiping and whatnot.  a steel front end  250 i think.  a locker 200.  and i'll need lower gears for the tires so that 600 more dollors.  sooo...

stock Calmini lift    $900+
steel front end      $250
locker                    $200
gears                    $600

total                     about 2000 bucks  

stu

in that 900+ though u are paying for convience..theres really not a TON of things that can spuratily go wrong..plus u have a set of instructions to fallow..if u put the SAS together and run into a problem it may take u a while to chase down..just things to think about

the day calmini makes there SAS kit is the day the bike gets left alone and the geo gets a lift =)
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Offline tracker8wr

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #22 on: May 19, 2004, 09:24:00 AM »
i read everything ya'll r saying and the money aspect is hard to over come, but if u crawl rocks sas is the way to go. more flex, stronger, and ah of course bigger tires. so if power is an issue get a turbo one of the guys on this forum was offering to build them for sell. if there were more lifts available for a trac/kick i don,t think many people would even consider an SAS. but to build a custum ifs lift it would cost way more with alot more geometry to figure. a local off road shop in town offered to aligen my SAS for $300 i just had to get it pretty close and they would take it from there.
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Offline Natebert

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #23 on: May 19, 2004, 09:40:17 AM »
Quote
I have to agree with Mike here, as when I was looking at SAS'ing my kick, the price of doing that would've been far greater than doing the steel GV housing that I plan on doing.

Just out of curiosity, does anyone know the cost of Heather and Nate's rig? Could give a nice comparison of the cost of SAS and GV front. :-/


Here is a quick run down of our estimated costs.

Front:
Misc steel for cross members, t-case brackets, spring/shackle hangers, shackles, etc = ~200
Dual t-case setup 600 (OTT kicker 3) + ~200 (stock sammy case )= ~800
Calmini rock crawler gears = 1000 (kicker case)
Custom drive line w/long slip + high clearance joints = ~400
Custom front housing = ~250 Sky manufacturing
Custom front axle shafts = ~300
Double tough Birfields = ~200
Jeep Wrangler YJ 2" lift leafs = ~300
ubolts, spring plates, spring perches = ~100
long travel shocks = ~100
rear 3rd member Sidekick = ~200
lengthened break lines = ~50
Sammy sway bar and brackets = ~50
Welding wire, gas, paint, bolts other misc shop materials = ~150
2 Sammy tie rods modified for stearing = ~100
Mercedes stearing arms modified = ~50

Total ~4200 for the front leaf sprung over.

For Rear;
YJ 4" lift springs = ~300
ubolts, spring plagtes, spring perches =~100
long travel shocks = ~100
Custom drive line w/long slip + high clearance joints = ~400
lengthened break line =~25

So probably add ~1000 for doing the rear leaf sprung over

Grand total ~5200 for keeping it 'in the family' Suzuki products.

We have lots of travel, (unmeasured at the tire at this time, but 16 inches of travel at the shocks.)
Lots of clearence.  (23 inches at the lowest part of the frame)
Lots of power with the reduction in high due to the sammy case.
Lots of low range due to the rock cralwer gears.
Easily room for 36 inch tires.
20 forward gears, 4 reverse gears.
Bearly fits inside the garage (~2 inches to spare)

It could be done a little cheaper to just have a Sammy front end widened ~6 inches and 1 custom axle shaft made.

You'd still need to address strength in the front axles and birfields.  And you'd need to address the slip in the drive lines as the stock slip yokes on the stock case is probably going to be way too short to handle all of the extra travel.  (I'd ask Eric B about how he addressed his).
You could also do without all of the extra gearing options we chose to go with.  (the Sammy case solved the fixed flange issue at the t-case)

But overall I would say that this is a quick and accurate estimate of our costs.
Please note that a SAS suspension is VERY different from an IFS setup with regards to ride and capability.
Both with Pros and Cons.
~Nate

« Last Edit: May 19, 2004, 09:49:04 AM by natebert »

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Offline Bobzooki

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #24 on: May 19, 2004, 09:47:06 AM »
Quote
Please note that a SAS suspension is VERY different from an IFS setup with regards to ride and capability.  Both with Pros and Cons.
~Nate


So, Nate, I'd say you are a PRO at this by now - can they convict you of KickSASing?  If they did, then you would be a CON...

::)
Bob

Tahoe 24' Fish-N-Fun Tritoon
115 HP Mercury outboard

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Offline Natebert

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #25 on: May 19, 2004, 09:51:44 AM »
Quote


So, Nate, I'd say you are a PRO at this by now - can they convict you of KickSASing?  If they did, then you would be a CON...

::)


Nice..... ;D

P.S.  We really like our SAS kick.  And a final comment, there is something to be said about the fact that there are plenty of Calmini 3 inch +3 inch lifted trucks around, but NONE have anything but highspeed cornering over ours.

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Offline Bobzooki

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #26 on: May 19, 2004, 09:56:18 AM »
Quote
NONE have anything but highspeed cornering over ours.


And where I live, high speed cornering is really important!   ;)
Bob

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Offline Mikerpm4x4

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #27 on: May 19, 2004, 09:58:38 AM »
Quote


Nice..... ;D

P.S.  We really like our SAS kick.  And a final comment, there is something to be said about the fact that there are plenty of Calmini 3 inch +3 inch lifted trucks around, but NONE have anything but highspeed cornering over ours.


::) I disagree or I would have SASed already.

BTW... good one Bob!LOL

Mike
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You wont really know if your wrong till your upsidedown

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Offline Mikerpm4x4

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #28 on: May 19, 2004, 09:59:37 AM »
Quote


And where I live, high speed cornering is really important!   ;)

And where I live So is jumping! ;D
« Last Edit: May 19, 2004, 10:00:28 AM by Mikerpm4x4 »
If your not living life to the fullest then your not living at all.

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Offline Natebert

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Re: should i go SAS or not???
« Reply #29 on: May 19, 2004, 10:08:01 AM »
 
;D ;D ;D(I knew that'd get a rise out of you guys....) ;D ;D ;D
« Last Edit: May 19, 2004, 10:08:23 AM by natebert »