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Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!

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Offline HUMZUKI

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Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« on: February 03, 2005, 05:54:11 AM »
Alright,,,,,,To make a long story short.

Long story---
http://www.zukiworld.com/


Short story---
I though my cam/crank timing was off b/c I had NO power. But I checked and it was on spec. So I desided to retard the Cam timing i tooth of the timing belt.

Now,,,,,,That was an impressive improvment,but,,,,still not quite what I had. So I figure the plugs are screwd. Nope but I changed them anyway. No better. Then Im thinkin,,,,,WTF is the air filter cloged.

THEN IT DAWNS ON ME!!!!! :o :o :o

O'CRAP!!! When it snowed two weeks ago I noticed my snorkle was filling with snow so I PUT A RAG IN IT, and forgot about it when I started it later to play in the snow. [burried]

I actually thought to my self " Hm,,,,I guess the rag fell out" What an A$$.

Any way I pulled the 3'x2' constriction from my snokle and whent for a ride.


A VERY, FAST RIDE!!!! Now this thing is pulling HARD!!!! It feels WAY better than It EVER HAS!!!! Every thing is set up exactly like I had it when it was before ASIDE from the cam. It is deffinatly off a tooth! I know about every 5deg you off set it you change your "powerban" by about 200 rpm but, $hit man Whats up?!?! Im trying to find some one that sells an adjustable cam sproket but I think Rotational Dynamics whent under, so RR and RG don't have'em any more.

Any one know were I can gat one? I really want to mess around with this now. Huge Improvement!!!!!



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Offline cj

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Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2005, 08:35:07 AM »
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Offline HUMZUKI

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Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2005, 08:59:16 AM »
LOL,,,,No thanks bro. I almost forgot about that place. THERE just a tad over priced,,,,eh? :o

$350 for a 3" bodylift

Stage 1 cam,,,,$895

Plug wires,,,,$115

Rear disk kit bare $495

$125 Hi Lift Jack



::)
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Offline cj

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Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2005, 09:08:32 AM »
Yeh, I know not cheap but don't forget it priced in Australian Pesos. I've actually had a look at one of these type of gears and if you had the gear you could modify a stock one to do the job quite easily.
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Offline TN_Tracker

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Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2005, 09:48:41 AM »
1 Australian Dollar = 0.770749 US Dollar ;)
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Offline Rhinoman

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Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2005, 10:56:07 PM »
I did a similar thing to a moped years ago. It was very fast at the top end but took about 10 mins to get it started. When I realised the valve timing was out I thought that I was going to get a big power increase, instead I lost about 5mph, it would start first kick though. How is your bottom end and mid range power?
On my old race bike the cam sprocket had the holes slotted to correct the timing
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2000 Vitara 1.6, 3+3 Lift, 33"MTs, 5:83s, LWB brakes, Winch, Snorkel, Safari Rack
1986 SJ413K PickUp, 1.6L conversion.

OBD1 - Full diagnostics on a PC/Laptop: http://www.rhinopower.org
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Offline HUMZUKI

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Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #6 on: February 04, 2005, 01:34:46 AM »
Starts 1-2 cranks,,,, No problem
LOL!!!! [censored]!!! I had a blast drivin to work today!!! Even on I95

I was basting past fools doing like 70-80.  Kinda scary but I couldn't resist. 1-3K is just a tap of the skinny now(I don't even notice it, it go's by so fast) And right at 3k UP I almost convinced my boy I put thre turbo on. SICK!!! Iv got fab a trak bar now.
Maybe There's something wack'd with my engine,,,,but I don't even know if I should even put the turbo on now.
I do have a weber, ported intake, underdrive, thorly, and a 2.5" pipe. Maybe that has somthing to do with it.
I'm trying to convince my friend to let me retard his 1.6 but he's basicly stock so I don't know if that will have the same effect. But It'll only take 30-40min,,,,I might just do it when he's not looking.  And post the aftermath.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2005, 01:35:20 AM by HUMZUKI »
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Offline wildgoody

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Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #7 on: February 04, 2005, 01:54:48 AM »
There was a company that made a
variable valve timing gear for the VW
1.8L engines, worked on RPM, and
would vary thru the RPM range, I
always thought it was a good idea,
this way you can be bottom end
torquey and top end revvy, problem
on the Zuke motor is the cam drives
the dizzy   :(
« Last Edit: February 04, 2005, 01:38:46 PM by wildgoody »
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Offline Rhinoman

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Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2005, 02:18:47 AM »
Quote
problem
on the Zuke motor is the cam drives
the dizzy   :(



So the timing is probably advanced too. I always thought that it might be possible to get a useful increase by swinging the timing forward a few degrees. My Vitara is supposed to run on 88+ octane or something like that (haven't got the fsm to hand) regular gas here is 95/96 Octane. Adjustable sprocket sounds good, was that done with springs and centrifugal force?
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2000 Vitara 1.6, 3+3 Lift, 33"MTs, 5:83s, LWB brakes, Winch, Snorkel, Safari Rack
1986 SJ413K PickUp, 1.6L conversion.

OBD1 - Full diagnostics on a PC/Laptop: http://www.rhinopower.org
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proud2bcdn

Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2005, 05:36:58 AM »
Has anyone tried that mod on an 8V? I'm always looking for more power...and my engine has quite a few mods as well...hmmmm...time to order that underdrive pulley from RRO ;)
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Offline wildgoody

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Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2005, 01:44:02 PM »
Quote



So the timing is probably advanced too. I always thought that it might be possible to get a useful increase by swinging the timing forward a few degrees. My Vitara is supposed to run on 88+ octane or something like that (haven't got the fsm to hand) regular gas here is 95/96 Octane. Adjustable sprocket sounds good, was that done with springs and centrifugal force?



Ya, I was thinking about it, the way I remember it,
cam timing works opposite of ignition timing, retard
is good for top end and advance is good for bottom
end, so a cam sprocket that retards at RPM would
be good for a turbo motor, retards for reduced pre
detonation under high boost and RPM

Ya, I think it was a counter weight and spring setup,
not sure how much weight would be needed to move
a cam shaft tho, seems like it would take quite a bit
to make the cam stable at a specified RPM

Wild
« Last Edit: February 04, 2005, 01:48:50 PM by wildgoody »
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Offline 90Stomper

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Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2005, 02:45:54 PM »
when you say 'retard' you mean that you left the belt where it was and moved the cam gear back (counter clockwise) 1 notch.  i can see how this would work, but didnt this really mess with your timing?  i have my timing advanced 20*, isnt that the same thing or am i off here? ???
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Offline wildgoody

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Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2005, 04:25:17 PM »
What we have here are two different
"timings" one is Valve Timing (cam retard)
and the other is Ignition Timing (distributor
movement)

By moving the cam back one tooth, you retard
the valve timing, but because the distributor is
also driven from the cam, it too will get some
retard of the ignition timing, in a N Asperated
engine this is not the best, but in a Turbo Engine
the retard can be good to reduce ping in the engine

Some boosted engines get a thing called boost
retard for this very purpose, Turbo Sprints had this
and I snapped one of the vacuum boost retard
cans from one at the wrecking yard for this purpose,
tho I have yet to put it in  ::)

Wild
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Proud2BCDN

Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #13 on: February 05, 2005, 02:48:43 AM »
OCC racing makes an adjustable cam sprocket as well as an underdrive pulley for Zuk 1.3, 1.6 8V and 1.6 16V engines

http://www.occracing.com/pricing.htm
« Last Edit: February 05, 2005, 02:49:51 AM by Proud2BCDN »
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Offline 1bigtracker

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Re: Retard Cam 1 tooth=MO POWER!!
« Reply #14 on: February 05, 2005, 03:23:38 AM »
that stuff looks alot cheaper than RRO.  would an under drive pulley for a 1.3 W/O A/C work on a 1.3 W/O A/C?

stu
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