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Rear ball joint drop

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Offline j2custom

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Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #45 on: January 29, 2005, 01:26:47 AM »
everyone thinking of turning their pinion up   please click on this link and read carefully. http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/tech/driveline/

I believe the point of the spacer is to turn the pinion down with the spacer, not up.  With the coil spacers it points the pinion up too much, and the ball joint spacer will point the front of the axle (pinion) down or almost level, similar to the t-case.  The other way is to cut off the coil mounts and turn the axle to the proper angle and then re attach.  That is my understanding.
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Offline wildgoody

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Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #46 on: January 29, 2005, 02:04:01 AM »
No, actually the 3" rise is to prevent the
balljoint from being torn apart at full droop,
the rotation turns the axle upward so it
points at the T-case output, if it were just
a 3" riser, the angles would remain the
same thru the axle articulation. with the
rotation the rear U-joint gets almost no
angle thru the articulation range, only
the T-case end gets to see any angle

Wild
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Offline mineisbroke

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Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #47 on: January 29, 2005, 04:08:18 AM »
the stock TJ rear driveshaft is only 12inches from ujoint to ujoint . i have one of these running 40 in swampers that had to have a double cardian shaft made and point the pinion straight toward transfer . this works well with the double joint . i still feel the traction suffers from this but has no vibrations .my tj only dreams of going places my zuke goes , but the gals really like jeeps .  
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Offline 90Stomper

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Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #48 on: January 29, 2005, 01:37:59 PM »
ok, after looking again... would someone please tell me why the pic on altavista and cardomain have all 4 bolt holes aligned top to bottom and the fabed steel one on here shows them offset?  just wondering, thanks.
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Offline wildgoody

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Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #49 on: January 29, 2005, 01:53:23 PM »
The other one does not rotate the diff upwards
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kerrywittig

Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #50 on: January 29, 2005, 02:35:52 PM »
So if I am reading the input on this thread correctly.........
The top and bottom "plate" should not be parallel, but rather have and inherient "angle"!
So what is the degree of angle that is optimum, and should it be  an acute angle towards the front of the vehicle or obtuse?
Or is ther an "offset" needed to relocate the balljoint mounting point?
If so what is that "offset" measurement?
OR............would the "best" of all worlds be non parallel
mounting surfaces and offset attachment points?
thanks in advance for answers!
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Offline wildgoody

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Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #51 on: January 29, 2005, 03:00:52 PM »
Hi Kerry  :)

I'm not sure what you are asking as far
as acute or obtuse, it's been too long and
I can't remember the difference between
them. But the answer is a two fold one,
according to the optimum U-joint operating
theory both input and output should be at
the same number of degrees, and yokes
kept parallel.

In my balljoint drop mod piece the offset
is about 2", the top plate is 2" forward and
3" higher than the bottom mount hole location
(see pic above) this rotats the diff upwards just
enough to point the input right at the output on
the Trans/T-case, and further it keeps pointing
towards the output thru the entire articulation
range, as well as moving the rear axle backwards
about 1" for better clearance of big tires, this is
one thing I forgot to mention in the previous posts,
without this rotation I don't think I could fit 33"
Swampers with no, that's right no rubbing in the
rear, not at full stuff, not off camber nothing, the
rear tire will not touch the body at any time.

Wild
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kerrywittig

Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #52 on: January 29, 2005, 03:50:56 PM »
Quote

I'm not sure what you are asking as far
as acute or obtuse, it's been too long and
I can't remember the difference between
them.


Acute would be an angle that ccloses in this case towards the front of the vehicle.
An obtruse would close towards the rear.
In other words the plates (top and bottom would lets say for sake of aurguement 1 1/2" apart top plate to bottom plate towards the front of the vehicle, i.e. acute.
Whereas the plates would say be  1'1/2' apart at the rear i.e. obtuse.
What I'm getting at is would there be any advantage in having the top and bottom surfaces non-parallel. Or all that need be is a "block" that is inserted to raise the balljoint?
The point being is there anything geometry wise that would be an improvement to the arch that the wishboone/axle travels when the rear axle/suspension travels/moves/articulates/cycles or what ever term you would use to describe it?
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Offline wildgoody

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Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #53 on: January 29, 2005, 04:33:06 PM »
 :)  Thanks for the geometry refresher

As far as non-parallel, I don't think there would
be any advantage for doing so, the balljoint seems
to be happy enough with the angles it's running at.

You could remove a sliver (pie piece) to get the balljoint
to be level, but I think this would just over complicate
a rather easy square cut for about 10* of change that
isn't or doesn't seem to be harming the balljoint anyway

Wild
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kerrywittig

Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #54 on: January 29, 2005, 04:37:42 PM »
10 degrees on the front or rear of the spacer?
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Offline wildgoody

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Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #55 on: January 29, 2005, 05:08:58 PM »
Top, where the balljoint bolt up
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kerrywittig

Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #56 on: January 29, 2005, 05:17:46 PM »
I understand that...................what I'm asking is would you angle it 10 degrees on the top plate, down v, towards the rear < of the vehicle or towards the front >?
By the way Goody I  apologize fot the persistence.....It's so hard to describe here in cyber......Hey I misplaced your tel#. Send it to me again and I will call and we can chat about this..Thanks Kerry
« Last Edit: January 30, 2005, 01:16:35 AM by kerrywittig »
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Offline SnoFalls

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Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #57 on: January 29, 2005, 07:38:03 PM »
If I understand this ...

The two spacer plates are parallel, but the fact that the axel is being offset rearward (by 1"), the pinion angle changes ...

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Offline Natebert

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Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #58 on: January 30, 2005, 02:47:51 AM »
When we were IFS, (like it was a sweet song) we shifted our ball joint 1 5/8" back and then extended our control arms 1 1/4" which extended our wheel base AND rotated our pinion up some.  (This worked out great for us)

~Nate
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Offline wildgoody

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Re: Rear ball joint drop
« Reply #59 on: January 30, 2005, 08:55:43 AM »
Quote
I understand that...................what I'm asking is would you angle it 10 degrees on the top plate, down v, towards the rear < of the vehicle or towards the front >?
By the way Goody I  apologize fot the persistence.....It's so hard to describe here in cyber......Hey I misplaced your tel#. Send it to me again and I will call and we can chat about this..Thanks Kerry



Well like I said, I don't think there is enough
to gain by taking a sliver off of the riser section,
but a sliver off the front would be the spot I was
thinking of, but the over complication isn't worth
the gain, if there even is any

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