Bolt in axle strength for track/kicks sounds great, and saves the fabrication of a solid axle swap.  However, the simplest way to address all the major issues: clearance, flex, strength, and serviceability is a solid axle swap.  Also, if you use leaf springs, the fab work would be minimized and it can be done CHEAPLY.

This thread is for IFS guys that want
to keep their IFS, SAS is a different solution
that we don't want, at least not yet.

Sorry, wasn't trying to kill the thread.  If a cost effective, bolt in solution for IFS strength can become a reality, it will be awesome.  I hope it works, but as you can tell I'm a solid axle believer.

Best solution is as follows:

New housing that accomodates a larger/stronger/inexpensive diff with R&P ratios that are "particular" to Kicks and Tracks!

Axles can be upgraded, (if one wants to or use stock OEM axle shafts, so be it) that will be stronger and bolt in, no knuckle or housing modifications!

Stock OEM drive shaft that bolts right up, with NO modifications, and no more than a one inch difference in location!

ALL mountig points are stock..NO relocation issues!

No welding, No fabbing, No lowering of x-member.
Remember when this happens, ground clearance diminishes, cutting and welding and modifying take place. Make it simple and easy.....Calmini's claim to fame!

And the best part............Easy afternoon install!

I don't understand how anyone here in Z world could find this to be a BAD idea! Unless it is the cost factor, which is relavent. I "predict" that if one wants to purchase one of these Unobtainium set ups, complete with upgraded axles that the cost will be in the $1000 dollar range....that's a "prediction" not a promise. Could be higher or lower...you never know until all the R&D and materials are added up. Without upgraded axles...............$500-600 range......

Hi all, I am sorry if I stepped on any toes with my post yesterday. the point of my message was to point out that a centered third member and stub axles does not create a solution to the strength problem we have in the front axle and CV's and infact introduces new problems into the system instead of making it better.

Because CV's are available which will allow a kick to ramp over 1000 using a standard width axle. I would conclude that axle width is not the issue. and since centering the third member creates problems, I wonder what benefit could be achieved by doing it.

Dave

Sorry, wasn't trying to kill the thread.  If a cost effective, bolt in solution for IFS strength can become a reality, it will be awesome.  I hope it works, but as you can tell I'm a solid axle believer.

Here is the SAS thread, was burried
http://www.zukiworld.com/cgi/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=suzuki_talk;action=display;num=1104194587

I don't mind you chimeing in, but I've heard plenty
on Pirate about "polishing a turd" and go SAS and
so on, I like my IFS, I've seen the Sammys bobbing
all over the place from the solid axle, and how I don't
I know there are benefits with SAS, and you know,
there are benefits with IFS too, there never will be a perfect offroad vehicle, there are just some situations
the SAS works better, or LWB works better, or SWB
works better, or IFS works better, more HP is better,
less HP is better, Swampers are better, AT's are better

you can't have the perfect truck, you make it the best
you can, learn what it does and doesen't do and go
from there, live with it, or mod it, or break it it's your
choice, have fun with it

You didn't kill this thread, and on the other hand
SAS has it's place here too, but we are dedicated to
the modding and beefing of IFS, I know one thing
IFS will always have more diff clearance tire for tire
than a SAS, so there is a disadvantage you can't
overcome, see pros and cons


Wild

You mean the Track/kick is not the perfect off road vehica???

I don't understand???

It's getting close  

I may have some crow to eat but I am not sure.

I have some pictures on my website of Mikes Tracker ramping over 1000 on his clubs ramp. I think that at that time he was using a modified sidekick rear axle in the front which was still the stock width with the Maxima CV's.

I did a search and found a post where Mike explains what he did to get that centered axle into his truck.

"Actually what Ive got is better than that. Im using a prototype Calmini anvil. The long side was elliminated and it is center mounted. Basicly it is just a suzuki 3rd member with 2 axle stubs hangin out. Then I built 2 passenger side Maxima shafts. (longer and larger)  

To center mount the diff I had to raise the motor 3 inches and also cut and drop the center cross member 1 1/2 inches.... along with the front. Then I flipped the tierod ends to the top of the knuckle to correct steering geometery. ( I was aware that I would flip the tie rods thats why I chose 1 1/2 inches.) This causes the fulcrum of the lower control arm to change requireing a 1 3/4 inch coil spring spacer to retain center clearance. This required a strut drop of 1 1/2 inches. (see a chain reaction  ) The final product was a 5 inch lift in the front.... so I leveled the back with a 1 1/2 inch spacer.... but that was too much angle on the rear arms and the rig would weird things on steep hill climbs. So I cut the frame where the upper v bar attaches and dropped it 2 inches. This made the upper link level on my rig. It still didnt feel right so cut the lower control arm bracket off the frame and moved it forward to the next hole in the frame. Then I made a pair of longer control arms out of 3/16 thick 1 3/4 dom tubing and had it bent with a high clearance like the Calimini 3 inch."

So it can be done, I wonder how much benefit was gained. What I really want to know now is if Mike thinks it was worth it and would he do it again?

I went out and looked at the front axle in little suzy it is about 2 feet wide stock. about the least you are going to get cutting it down is about 1 foot wide. In looking at the clearance around the axle now with my 2" Calmini lift it looks like by massaging the cross member and  moving the axle  down and forward an inch or so you could probably move the third member over far enough to take about 6" out of the axle.

another thing that I thought of is if I remember correctly the Ring gear is on the right or passenger side of the housing. This means that some housing could be trimmed from the top left side for oil pan clearance.

Dave

Ring is on the left (U.S. Drivers side)
of the carrier

Wild

Ohh I see a Crow  

So it can be done, I wonder how much benefit was gained. What I really want to know now is if Mike thinks it was worth it and would he do it again?
Dave

I would definately do it again. Sure I could RTI but that isnt everything. The durability then wasnt what it is today. I currently have a difficult time breaking anything on this rig with 35 inch BFG Krawlers on it. IFS or SAS you are going to have a hard time finding a rig more durable.

Center mounting the diff reduces operating angle while retaining clearance, that equals durability. The driveshaft angle is minimal. I have no vibration.

On the other hand I dont think this is a mod for the average person. Most people I think would deem this much fab work unnessicary. I think some stronger axles would be the answer for most people.

Mike

Mike, what did you do for axils?  Did you have special shafts made?

Mike, what did you do for axils?  Did you have special shafts made?

Which are you refering to? The cvs or the inners?

Ok, what are you doing for shaft?

I know you running the Maxima's.

This is actually a Calmini prototype Anvil. It has the same axle stub you have but this one has 2. One for each side.

Mike