Is the 9" available in a Centered IFS application or is this a custom unit.  

i'm a Ford guy and i've never seen one in a production car.  but let me wake up an if i think of anything, i'll be back.

stu

No this was a custom unit. Ford Thunderbird made a centered 8.8 rear though. Aluminum too. I doubt that low enough gears are availible though.

Mike

I like the Anvil, but with out shafts I'm back to square one.   4 wheeling season is coming soon

So get some shafts - what's the big deal?  If THAT's all that's holding you back, I say DO IT!

The Anvil ROCKS!

You can SORT OF see my Anvil, above my belly armor, in this shot!

So get some shafts - what's the big deal?  If THAT's all that's holding you back, I say DO IT!

Last check, The only better shafts I know of are:

1. Stock 26 spline
2. Hybrid DIYS  (Toyota / Nissan / Ford)
3. Unobtanium (stuff that has yet to hit the market)

The NAPA or other distributor life time warranty 26 spline units are sounding good.

If their are others, Please get me up to speed.

Last check, The only better shafts I know of are:

1. Stock 26 spline
2. Hybrid DIYS  (Toyota / Nissan / Ford)
3. Unobtanium (stuff that has yet to hit the market)

The NAPA or other distributor life time warranty 26 spline units are sounding good.

If their are others, Please get me up to speed.

OK, first:  You need a 26 spline long inner shaft.  I got mine from Hawk Strictly Suzuki 1-888-SAMURAI - they have anything you could want.

Next:  You need a driver's side outer shaft, for the passenger side (it's got 3 bolts, that join it to the inner short axle that comes with the Anvil).

Because of this, you need only carry driver's side outer shafts for spares, AND, Kerry Wittig is in the process of producing the Unobtnium and Neutronium outer shafts - they should be available in March.

What else?  You can go to Warn Premium Hubs - and HUB FUSES.  If you do, also convert to Spidertrax Super Hub Bolts http://www.spidertrax.com/drivetrain_shb.htm

No this was a custom unit. Ford Thunderbird made a centered 8.8 rear though. Aluminum too. I doubt that low enough gears are availible though.

Mike

They can be modifies to use ford 8.8 ring and pinion There is a wide range of r&P avail for that but it is a c clip retainer . I had a 5liter t-bird with 4.10s after my wife took 3 teeth off the ring gear racing a mustang. that was a fun car, 5.0 with all the go fast goodies from SVO. Just a big pig till we gutted the interior and made generous use of a hole saw and cut off wheel. you couldn't tell when we got it back together but it sure had more road noise . we auto crossed it for a while but she was faster than me I turned into the crew cheif  

Thanks
Wayne

Kerry, I have to admit, that Unobtainium is not "my" word - nor is "Administrivium"  - a material, which the more you machine it, the more you have...

But I think you SHOULD use the term anyway!

Neutronium, of course, (in my experience) came from an old Star Trek episode, where some big spliff-looking thing was eating planets, and the hull was made of Neutronium.

i'm a Ford guy and i've never seen one in a production car.  but let me wake up an if i think of anything, i'll be back.

stu

We have them in Australia in the Ford Falcon and there is a company that puts them into a GM IRS ($$$)from the Holden Commodore (a 4dr version of the Monaro that is exported to the US as the Pontiac GTO)

I think you guys are way off with this centered third member thing.

First of all the 9" ford is big (read tall). There is not enough room to put it under the oil pan without loosing ground clearance. I believe that ground clearance on the Sidekick/tracker should be our first consideration.

Second How much could you possibly gain by doing it. Mike has already shown that big travel is possible by just using a different CV. He used Maxima CV's, I don"t know what the max angle is on those but the Porsche 930 - CV Has a maximum angle of about 40 degrees. This is almost twice what the stock inner cup has. and they are extremely strong.

Now if we were designing long travel prerunner type front suspension where the A arms extend from the other side of the vehicle  there could be an argument made for this design. But given the limitations of the system we have. Shortened axles don't do much to help the problem everyone is having in the front end which is not enough strength or flex in the stock CV's

The last problem with a centered third member is that now the drive shaft is running at an extreme angle this will introduce more problems into the system. There will be accelerated wear of the u joints, possible vibration issues, as well as multiplication of normal torque stress's introduced into the system. This could result in catastophic failure under extreme conditions.

Dave Ulrich

Lil Suzys Dad

I think you guys are way off with this centered third member thing.

1.     There is not enough room to put it under the oil pan without loosing ground clearance. I believe that ground clearance on the Sidekick/tracker should be our first consideration.


2.    Second How much could you possibly gain by doing it. Mike has already shown that big travel is possible by just using a different CV. He used Maxima CV's, I don"t know what the max angle is on those but the Porsche 930 - CV Has a maximum angle of about 40 degrees. This is almost twice what the stock inner cup has. and they are extremely strong.

3.    Now if we were designing long travel prerunner type front suspension where the A arms extend from the other side of the vehicle  there could be an argument made for this design. But given the limitations of the system we have. Shortened axles don't do much to help the problem everyone is having in the front end which is not enough strength or flex in the stock CV's

4.    The last problem with a centered third member is that now the drive shaft is running at an extreme angle this will introduce more problems into the system. There will be accelerated wear of the u joints, possible vibration issues, as well as multiplication of normal torque stress's introduced into the system. This could result in catastophic failure under extreme conditions.

Dave Ulrich

Lil Suzys Dad

Dave,  Sorry but I have to disagree.  I think we are CENTERED right on target.

1.  I have dropped the crossmembers 4" and I do have the necessary room for a Hybrid centered chunk.  
    I believe that the only true way to get ground clearance under the axle on a Solid axle truck is by increasing the tire size.  Even wheeling an IFS Kick increased tire size is the best way to gain clearance.  The suspension when set up properly will cycle and you will loose gound clearance gained by setting the fron end up to ride extra high especially on the slow down hill crawl.   For an IFS truck to have the proper ride and handeling a maxed out overlifted front end in not the answer.  

2.  I am not an expert on Mikes truck but i do try to note and follow along.  He has way nore then just modified CV's.  As I recall some of his mods are  2" crossmember drop, Widened rear A-arm mounts, Centered custom Calmini Anvil diff and the modified CV's.   He has also addressed the steering and rear axle isses as well as many other aspects that I am yet unaware of.    

3.  Shortened axles don't do much to help the problem everyone is having in the front end which is not enough strength or flex in the stock CVs  I'm not sure I follow this statement.  The whole point of the centered diff in with the stock A-arms is to reduce the operating angle of the CVs.  The centered diff will use longer equal legnth CVs.  Longer front A-arms and more travel is the next logical step after modifying the diff and shafts.

4.  Stock the front drive shaft is running near perfect angles.  Offsetting the diff to center will only be a mild change.  The driveshaft will be running in a similar angle to the stock rear shaft on a lifted application only the angle will be near constant.  It should be no more than that of the current short wheel based rigs.  I do not see the drive shaft stregnth or ange being an issue at all.  Oil pan clearance maybe, but the lift and mild pan mods should make adequate clearance.

Only disadvantage I see to the centered theory diff is time money and spares.  All of the operating issues are a PLUS.



Below is Mikes previous post on this topic about installing his centered diff....

Just a heads up, just to fit a stock diff centered you need to lift the motor 5 inches just to clear the oil pan. My hood got in the way so I raised it 3 inches and cut the frame and dropped it 1.5 inches... then got a shoehorn... ...and its still close. My point is, its definately possible but most likely as a one off only.

Mike

It's not a lot but you can gain some  clearance by using a Sammi pan in place of the Kick one and minor mods to the pickup.

1.  I have dropped the crossmembers 4" and I do have the necessary room for a Hybrid centered chunk.  
 

Whitfield your missing the point............

What we are suggesting and hope to implement is a hybrid housing, ala Anvil type, that can be installed without fabbing, modifiying, cutting, welding of anything. Using simple hand tools and a floor jack and a few hours of time.

Install the housing (Unobtanium) to the exsisting mounting points, then install stronger larger axle shafts(TORA TORA)........Done!

the housing, does this include the third member or just the outer housing?? any new developments??

shane
ps. i could be a tester for ya if you need one or not.

Different housing
Different third member
Different axle shafts

All the above bolts right in............simple!

The drive shaft would have to go thru the oil
pan, a Sammy pan would not help. If you followed
Mikes install, he lifted the engine to get the clearance
needed for the driveshaft. So you have two choices,
lift the engine, or drop the crossmember, lifting the
engine could be done with risers for the motor mounts,
but you also need a body lift to clear the top of the engine.
Dropping the crossmember is not a bolt in install.

I said months ago, widening the front A-arms, as well as moving them forward is the way to go, it would be bolt
on and weld upper control arms, slip shafts and away
you go, CVs replaced with units that have more degrees
of movment and a higher lift, I think around 6" front lift
would be no problem, with no CV problems and not over
lifted topped out in the travel either.

Any guinea pigs
PM Me