Let me start by saying that I don't think a vehicle can ever have too much power and that I am the type of driver that is normally way ahead of the rest of the pack when the light turns green.   But I find that the stock 1.6 8 valve in my 90 has more than enough power for the size of the engine and the weight of the truck.  I am still using the first one off the line with it at lights and when you step on it it gets out of it's own way!  The only real problem is trying to get up to 60 quickly from 0.  I am somewhat amazed at how well the 1.6 does for how small it is. 

Everybody has a different idea when it comes to power........

One of my boyhood idols was Trans Am series/Can-Am/Indy Car and Formula One driver Mark Donahue.....his words on the topic were something like

 " If I can't smoke the tires at 200mph in top gear I don't have enough power"

With the Zuks most of what I have read on the board is a greater need for low rpm torque, for trail work, rock crawling.

Me I like high rpm hp, thats why I went with the Rally idea for my project. High speed, high rpm power.......if I had my way I'd do a full tilt DOHC 1.6/16v that peaked up around 75-8000rpm, do 120mph and accellerate like a scared cat.

To each their own.......and that's as it should be!

As a street piece the Zuks do well because they are light and highly (comparatively) geared so they accelerate well...but once up to 5th...different story.

Zag

Everytime I see a topic like this I think of that crazy Tracker that was on Ebay with the V8 in it. Can you imagine the look on some hotshot's face in a ricer sitting beside you as you smoke 'em at the lights. It sure makes people take a second look!

steveo

Enough power? I don't think so. They're a good little rig but certainly can do with more. Me, I'm just greedy and want more everywhere    It's not so much about peak power as it is about increasing the torque across the rev range.

A big fat torque curve is the way to go for me. A friend over here put a Nissan SR20 turbo motor in a Sammy. He bolted on a super charger, fitted up an aftermarket Engine Management System and got 212 bhp at the wheels - but the torque and acceleration is what impress's me. Still a light rig but with lots more go! It would be awesome in the rocks and this thing gets air in the mud

Ok here are some little stats of the cars I have driven here in Colorado.

Just after the onramp to the freeway where I head to work every day, there is a sign.  The old 89 Crown Vic did'nt care if it had a head wind, or the ac was on, but bye the time I got to that sign, it was about 80mph.  150bhp V8.  The 99' grand caravan, no head wind, and you punched it good, maybe 80.  158-168 hp (I am guessing) V6.  The 01' PT Cruiser, no ac, tail wind, 80.  150hp 4banger.  My friend's 95' Toyota 4runner, recient tune up, no ac, 70. 170hp? V6.  95' 4dr sidekick,no ac, no headwind, 70-75.  1.6 16v, 95 hp
all are automatics except for the kick.  The Vic,Van,PT  all get the same 20-21mpg around town. 4runner....16mpg freeway.   When I keep lighter foot, I get 27mpg around town with the kick.  Sure it would be nice to have PT's power and automatic.  Yes the 4 runner is nicer and bigger, But for what the kick is, I am suprised  how well it holds its own.  My problem is still that Vic had that comfort.... I guess my age is creeping up.
Jeff
Ps. Had a 4dr 92 tempo that did the same as the PT, but with less hp and style. Its still sitting here. no reverse, anybody need it cheap?

Good points

     The Track/Kick is a great little rig stock...for what it is. Doesn't mean it can't be alot better.

Zag

Yep
 

Good points

     The Track/Kick is a great little rig stock...for what it is. Doesn't mean it can't be alot better.

Zag

Ok Bud, diffrent filter, diffrent muffler and pipe, maybe diffrent header.  What else can help without cracking the thing open or forced induction.  You said what a good engines these things had, so I hope mine aint any near cracking open.   I do plan on doing the drop in k/n or somthing diffrent on the intake and I need a new muffler some time, but I dont expect much in increased hp.  I also really miss the Vic's V8 for torque, even though that 302 was no powerhouse, the Vic was a big car. It held to road pretty good on snow and ice for a rear wheel car.  What really suprises me is that the kick feels just as stable in those same conditions in 4wd.   Ã‚ The Pt is nearly the same size as my kick, it has 55 more horses, but I am not impressed with that extra 55.  I know how Wild is wild about his 150hp turbo, but is it that much diffrence? My wife doesnt like that I am not too impressed with the PT. Only had the Pt a few months, maybe it needs a air filter.  Ive seen cone ones for the PT for around 25$ on ebay, looks you could put that thing on anything, been thinking of trying it on the van and the zuk.  The guy at autozone said the MAF sensor would go out if you put a highflow filter on a higher mileage car. what do you think?
I have also beat around the bush before, not to sound stupid, but here goes....
WHY does the Ebay "electric" superchager not work?  I did not believe it would, but I was wondering why?
I have to get these questions to you before you become a big sponser.  Just kidding.  I liked reading your bit on the watercooler.  ( and all your other stuff)  I may had a surgery last week, and I may feel up to changing the speedo cable in a few days, what a long recovery.  I may write about in in the watercooler later.
thanks
Jeff

Ok lets look at what can be logically done without opening her up.

First think of the engine as a complete system and not make single changes...ie big exhaust, keep stock aircleaner...not effective.

Second, what do you want it to do, that it isn't doing now? It's easy to say more power,but do you mean more in the same rpm range? Do you do a lot of severe off road...or just trail running?

Those questions asked FWIW heres what IMHO I would do with a stock1.6/8valve as a first step. (Assuming no water fording or deep muddin, just trail running and street driving.)

1) Damn good tune up, high quality wires, plugs rotor and cap...compression test etc make sure
    everything is healthy.
2) New timing belt, retard cam mark 1 tooth (I've tried it and so have others makes a
    difference, costs nothing)
3) 2" TBI Spacer
4) Low restriction aircleaner...like the one Prd2BCdn is trying out for me (it eliminates the
    aluminum intake tube). Pics are on the forum for an example.
5) Good header with the proper square ports, tri y is probly best for off roading.
6) Full 2 1/8 to 2 1/4 exhaust with a quality muffler of your choice and a cat (same dia) if you
    need it to keep legal.
7) Power time the engine, old school but it works and costs "0"
Go synthetic gear lube in diffs, trans and t/case. Tried it drag racing and we found it made a
    measureable difference in the 1/4 mile. (about a 10th in our 240Z w 4.37:1 gears, locked diff)

Best guess...this will take you to 85-90hp...maybe a little better. thats about a 7-12% increase is useable power and if you drive the same as you do now about the same improvement in gas mileage.

Will you feel it. Assuming your vehicle weighs 2500lb and stock hp is 80 thats 31.25lb/hp
These mods will drop your lb/hp to between 27.7 to 29.41. Thats like cutting between 150-280 lbs off your vehicle weight..you'll feel it.

If you don't use all the new power you should boost gas mileage as well (rarely happens cause everyone I know promptly uses all the power)..about 7%...if you are getting 25mpg you should jump to about 26.75mpg or a little better.

Whats it gonna cost........well I figure the tune up and timing belt don't count cause thats regular maintanance stuff. If you are a good scrouger and fab the aircleaner and TBI spacer, buy a Calmini or similar header and do the exhaust yourself....well under $500.00...if you're lucky and score some good deals maybe under $300.00.

Am I sure it will work? Well similar mods on my wifes 1.6/16v produced similar results to these and I've done these same mods to a bunch of our street drivers over the years and got similar results. Sometimes a little more by percentage, I can't remember getting any less by percentage.

why does it work? Because you are addressing the engine as a system, allowing it to get fuel and air in easier and out easier, and one helps the other getting an appreciable net gain.

As far as "Wild" being wild about his combo, you bet. Does it make that much difference, done right for sure.

Think about the same 2500lb Tracker we talked about that is 31.25lb/hp stock, with "Wilds" turbo engine that same Tracker now has only 16.6lb/hp...thats like cutting the weight of the Tracker in about 1/2...now it's a rocket!

The reason you're not impressed with the PT comes down to the same thing...power to weight, you might have 55hp more but I'll bet you are hauling at least 800lb more weight..kinda defeats the purpose.

Hope that explains things better.

Electric superchargers....lets think this one through

Lets assume for sake of agrument that the electric supercharger is going to produce 7psi boost at 5500 engine rpm.
Thats approx 75cubic feet per minute...a compressor that moves 75 CFPM requires around 8hp if I remember correctly (direct drive). Now if an electric motor is 75% efficent that means the supercharger is now requiring about 11hp to run and the alternator has to produce the power. Now here my math and memory are pretty weak but 11hp is about 8.4kw and assuming 75% efficency for the Alternator I think that will end up being around a 20+ horsepower draw if our efficencies are that high (and I don't think they are) Now add the weight etc relating to an alternator big enough to produce 8.4kw and you efficeny drops furthur...and we haven't talked belt slip or anything else.

So in a perfect world and not counting many other power losses in the system we are eating up 20hp...what do we get? Well 7psi is about 1/2 an atmosphere so if we get 80hp at 1.0
atmoshpere we should (again in a perfect world) about 120hp |removethispart|@ 1.5....less the 20hp it took to create the 7psi (1/2 atmopsphere)..so absolute perfect world, best case you would gain 20hp over stock.......add god knows how much weight and complication, that will dimish the net power even more...and we are assuming efficency levels that are high and not counting electrical transmission losses, belt slippages and a bunch of other energy eaters.

But what I hope I was able to demonstrate is....

"In our real world...the electrical power required and ineffiecencies would eat any hp gains"

Well those are my thoughts and opinions as best I can give them at 1:20am...hope it helped to explain things a little better (hope I didn't make too many math and memory errors).

Thanks
Zag

Ooops

Missed aircleaner and MAF.....I have never heard of a low restriction airfilter having any effect on a MAF. Sounds like El Toro Poo Poo to me. Has anyone out there ever heard of such a problem? I've never seen it.

Zag

The reason you're not impressed with the PT comes down to the same thing...power to weight, you might have 55hp more but I'll bet you are hauling at least 800lb more weight..kinda defeats the purpose.

Heh, my wifes turbo PT has 215hp (probably 230) ... now that is a fun ride!