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2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara

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Offline stunt

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #75 on: February 28, 2005, 03:34:17 AM »
The 2.7 definately feels a lot stronger than the 2.5.  I went ahead and picked up some flexible 3" hose and connected the MAF to the air filter.  Put about 100 miles on the "new" engine so far.  There was a lot of valve train noise for the first several miles, but I think that was caused by the hydraulic lifters due to the engine sitting for 2 years.  Now it runs smooth as butter.

Hills that would cause a downshift into 3rd with the 2.5 are overtaken effortlessly in 4th now.


I got the tach working (just had it going to the wrong pin on the PCM).  Getting the 4x4 working was the biggest challenge.  I had to locate this circuit board under the dash and re-route all the wires to the PCM as it controls the air pump on 2002 models.   I went ahead and unsoldered the connector from the circuit board and use that as a plug into the harness.  I did this because it was very tight up under the dash, and it would have sucked to have to do my soldering there.



Now I'm just waiting on the proper airbox from 95XL7 and the 2.7 outlet pipe, and I'll be all done.  Heater and A/C controls all function 100% despite 2 wires from the 2000 PCM not being used on the 2002.  Cruise is also working 100%.

The only thing that is a bit funky is the O/D switch on the shift lever.  On 2000 models, the button is either in or out.  I suspect the 2002 is a momentary switch.  I have to press it twice to toggle in and out of O/D, but if that's the only compromise, I can certainly live with it.

Despite all the re-wiring, the swap was well worth it and the wife feels like she has a brand new ride now, so its a win-win.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2005, 04:37:00 AM by stunt »
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Offline 97TRAKIN

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #76 on: February 28, 2005, 08:59:22 AM »
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On 2000 models, the button is either in or out.  I suspect the 2002 is a momentary switch.


You're correct it is not like the older in/out switch it is a momentary switch.
If you turn the overdrive off in the newer trucks, when you turn off the ingnition and turn it back on again the overdrive is back on. It does'nt stay off when you restart, you have to turn it off again.
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Offline stunt

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #77 on: February 28, 2005, 11:53:19 PM »
Quote


You're correct it is not like the older in/out switch it is a momentary switch.
If you turn the overdrive off in the newer trucks, when you turn off the ingnition and turn it back on again the overdrive is back on. It does'nt stay off when you restart, you have to turn it off again.


That's what I thought.  Thanks.  I wonder if a 2000 shifter can be retrofitted with the momentary switch?
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Offline Natebert

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #78 on: March 01, 2005, 04:13:29 AM »
Great job!
I loved the pics.
We've thought about upgrading the motor in our 95, but have often wondered exactly what type of stuff is involved.  This helps a lot!

~Nate

« Last Edit: March 01, 2005, 04:13:43 AM by natebert »
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Offline Zukipilot

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #79 on: March 01, 2005, 05:00:18 AM »
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Great job!
I loved the pics.
We've thought about upgrading the motor in our 95, but have often wondered exactly what type of stuff is involved.  This helps a lot!

~Nate



Yea, it let's you know that you have to be one hell of a Mechanic and an Electrical Engineer to do a job like this.

Great Job,

Zig
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Zukipilot
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Offline stunt

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #80 on: March 01, 2005, 05:27:01 AM »
Thanks guys.  This sure was a lot more complicated than swapping the 300 straight 6 (threw a rod |removethispart|@ 100k) on my 4-speed equipped '81 Ford F150 4x4 with a 351W.  That just took a couple of new mounts and a starter!

If you are thinking of doing a swap like this, definately take your time with the electrical.  I also strongly recommend getting a connector pin removal tool for the ECM pins.  I did the first 10 or so with a paper clip, but some of the pins can be a real bitch.  Once I got the proper tool, it was soo much easier to do the remaining 25 or so pins.

With one exception (rear window defrost) I found that even though the various connections were in different locations on the various connectors, the color coding of the wires remained the same.

I'm still waiting on my scanner upgrade (for imports) so that I can see why the SES light is on.   I'm hoping its an old code that I just need to clear.  Engine runs great and my guess is that the milage will be around 20-21 mpg which I understand is about right for an XL-7 in winter months.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2005, 05:28:09 AM by stunt »
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Offline ebewley

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #81 on: March 01, 2005, 06:59:34 AM »
Quote

 There was a lot of valve train noise for the first several miles, but I think that was caused by the hydraulic lifters due to the engine sitting for 2 years.  Now it runs smooth as butter.



My 2.7 sounded like yours did as well. It clattered for several minutes maybe even up to a half hour or so. But then it quited down and has been smoooooth ever since...

-Eric
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Offline 97TRAKIN

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #82 on: March 01, 2005, 08:28:56 AM »
If it were me doing this swap Suzuki would have already built a V8 by the time I got the wiring figured out.
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Offline stunt

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #83 on: March 05, 2005, 04:07:49 AM »
I got the airbox from 95XL7 and the connecting pipe and resonator from the dealer.  Looks very factory now:



I also got my scantool upgrade so I was finally able to scan the PCM to see why the service engine light was on.  Well, the scanner didn't pick up any DTCs, which was weird.  But I was able to clear it, but it came back on again within 10 seconds.  So I scanned the various parameters that it was monitoring, and the MAF was returning a constant value of a wopping 281.35 grams/second (g/s) at idle and the value remained constant when I reved the engine.

It should be around 2.6 - 4.5 g/s at idle, and something like 10.0 - 16.0 g/s at 2500 RPM.  So I got out the voltmeter and sure enough, the MAF was sending a constant voltage of around 9V as opposed to a value between 1V and 4V depending on engine speed.

Luckly I located another MAF off a '02 XL-2, so I'm off the the junkyard on Monday to pick it up.  Hopefully that will be the final chapter of this engine swap.

I'm surprised how well the engine runs despite a malfunctioning MAF, and I also don't quite understand why my scantool didn't pick up any DTCs, yet allowed me to clear them.
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Offline 97TRAKIN

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #84 on: March 05, 2005, 08:48:59 AM »
Quote

I'm surprised how well the engine runs despite a malfunctioning MAF,


I was shocked to find out that they will run well even with the MAF unplugged, the 1.6 anyway. Have'nt tried it with my V6 yet.
My wifes nissan sputters and stalls if you do that.

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95xl7

Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #85 on: March 05, 2005, 08:58:10 AM »
Glad to see the airbox was put to good use! 8)
I had my MAF go bad too, and had to get a used one from the bone yard. I think i might have shorted it out when trying to figure out the wiring. :-[
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Offline stunt

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #86 on: March 07, 2005, 10:05:10 AM »
Well, I got another MAF from the bone yard, but it behaves exactly like the one that came with the engine in that my scan tools shows 281.35 g/s no matter what the engine rpm.  :(

12V and ground checks out fine at the MAF connector.  This is also where I measure the 9V signal coming from the sensor.

I suppose I can try disconnecting the signal at the MAF end to see if it remains |removethispart|@ 9V to rule out the PCM being messed up as that is really the only other possible cause of this issue according to the service manual.

I suppose I can try to sweet talk the dealership into letting me try a known good MAF and PCM (or have them try it and me pay them the labor $$$), but I have a feeling they aren't going to be very accommodating.

Since the car runs great and the mileage as about the same as before, I wonder what the long term effects would be to just leave things the way they are?
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95xl7

Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #87 on: March 07, 2005, 01:41:42 PM »
did you try swapping the wires around on the MAF? Like swapping the two end wires, the center can only be the center,but switch the #1 and#3 wires around and retry it.
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Offline stunt

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #88 on: March 09, 2005, 12:25:50 AM »
I haven't tried that, but since I now have 2 MAFs I might as well give it a shot with one of them.  That will basically flip 12V and ground to the unit, but maybe that is the problem.  I did meassure battery voltage with the ignition on at the pin they show in this picture.  But who knows...

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Offline stunt

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Re: 2.5 to 2.7 swap in 2000 Grand Vitara
« Reply #89 on: March 11, 2005, 11:55:42 PM »
Turns out my ground wire going to the ECM was faulty.  I wired the MAF directly to the battery and measured the output voltage.  It was around 2.2V at idle as it should be and increased with RPMs.

So I replaced the ground wire and all is well.  Cleared the check engine light and it didn't come back on.  There is no longer a slight hesitation when taking off from a stop.  So this finally wraps up the swap!
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